MR. LOWE said, a salary of £400 | had to contend against the insidious ena-year, inserted in the original Bill, was croachments of those enemies of the now proposed to be raised to £1,000 Common Law, the jurists and members of a-year. He should have thought that the Court of Chancery. Some of these increase of salary was only justified when learned gentlemen were no more to be earned by services. He would appeal regarded as custodians of the law and to the Chancellor of the Exchequer to liberties of the people than a pack say whether it was desirable to raise of wolves were to be considered as guarsalaries prospectively for places which dians of a flock of sheep. He entered were not intended at present to be filled his protest against destroying a system up. When the occasion occurred, the of law which had no parallel in the Government could come to the House history of the world, and which, once for the salary. He protested in the destroyed, could not be restored. The name of the taxpayers against a proceed- result of these efforts would be to reduce ing which was contrary to the whole the Common Law to the state of the civil genius of our finance, and might be law. While entering this protest, he fraught with the grossest jobbery. must also express a hope that the Judges would have sufficient strength of character and good sense to adhere to the principles characteristic of the system of Common Law. In conclusion, he could not help bearing his testimony to the ability which the hon. and learned Attorney General had shown in conducting the measure through the House.

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL said, that after the appeals made to him, he would yield his own opinion, and consent to the clause being negatived.

Amendment agreed to; clause struck out accordingly.

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL said, he must now appeal to the House to read the Bill a third time, as the matter was one of urgency. He would accordingly move the third reading.

Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Bill be now read the third time." (Mr. Attorney General.)

MR. WHALLEY said, that, under the circumstances upon which he then addressed the House, at a time when it was laying unhallowed hands upon the principles of the Constitution as embodied in the Common Law, he could scarcely call it a privilege, for he rather thought it a misfortune that he happened to be a Member of it. He had had much experience as a lawyer, and in that House, and he must say that although that subject had been under consideration for some years, he had failed to master it. Four or five years ago the House was called upon to pass a Bill, and it had since been led on from Session to Session until they were now told that unless they passed the present measure all would be thrown into confusion. He appealed from those benches to the Judges of the land, and he exhorted them to persevere in the policy they had adopted of protesting against the ignorant and most ill-considered action of the House in disregarding and subverting the principles of our jurisprudence. For centuries the people of this country had

Question put, and agreed to.

Bill read the third time, and passed, with Amendments.

CRUELTY TO ANIMALS BILL [Lords.] (Mr. Assheton Cross.)

[BILL 250.] SECOND READING. Order for Second Reading read.

MR. ASSHETON CROSS, in moving that the Bill be now read the second time, said, that in the observations he had to make he hoped he would not wound the most sensitive feelings of those who were engaged in the medical profession, or in the pursuit of scientific inquiry. They lived now, as had been well said, in an age of progress, and probably in no intellectual pursuit had greater progress been made than in medical science and scientific inquiry. One of the results of that great advance had no doubt been a tendency to increase experiments made for scientific and medical purposes upon living animals, for the purpose of finding out something that might tend to alleviate human suffering and prolong human life. Such experiments had prevailed very much more abroad than they had in England; but even here, for some years, the tendency to pursue this peculiar branch of study had been on the increase; and the increase was not only

sons ought to be made. In the interests, therefore, not only of humanity, but also of science, Her Majesty's Government appointed a Royal Commission to inquire into the question. It was not for him, having had something to do with the appointment of that Commission, to say much about it; but he believed the general feeling had been, and was still, that those who were appointed were fully qua

vestigation of the facts, and to put them before Parliament in such a way as to insure a wise and proper conclusion being arrived at upon the question. The Com

present, but also prospective. There could be no doubt that in some of the principal medical schools experiments by way not only of original research, but as demonstrations to students, were growing to a considerable degree, and that a strong feeling had been raised throughout the country by the circulation of reports of many painful experiments that had been made, and also by the publication of a Handbook of Phy-lified to make a careful and impartial insiological Science, intended for beginners, which described very many such experiments. The word "beginners" misled many persons, and it was thought that a great number of unqualified per-missioners had made their Report, having sons were allowed to perform experiments which they could not perform properly, and of which they did not know the value. From all those circumstances a very strong feeling arose in the country against this practice, and the result of that feeling was tested by a meeting which was held in London in 1874, soon after which a Bill was brought into the other House by the noble Lord (Lord Henniker), and another one in this House by the right hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Lyon Playfair) for the purpose of putting some control on a practice which was growing, and was likely to grow. He wished to explain what the course of the Government had been in the matter. Well, Her Majesty's Government knew that there were two sides taken on this as on all other matters of a strongly marked and very opposite character. There were a great number of persons of the very highest character who desired to put a stop to the experiments altogether, and there were a great number of persons who were entirely and very properly devoted to scientific research who took a distinctly opposite view, and who thought that any control or check put upon this practice was to be deprecated, because it would injure the progress of scientific investigation. In this matter, as in many others, perhaps, the House would be of opinion that the truth lay between the two extremes. Parliament had no knowledge as to the extent or nature of the practices in question, and there was reason to believe that the country was equally not well informed upon the matter; and the Government were therefore of opinion that before legislation could be proposed on the subject a thorough investigation by the most competent per

taken a great deal of evidence. It was not his intention to enter fully into that evidence, but a considerable amount of evidence was brought before the Commissioners, some very strong reasons were given why experiments should be made, and the whole matter was thoroughly investigated. He did not propose to go into details on this part of the question, but he thought a considerable part of the Report must be satisfactory to the House. The Commissioners bore testimony to the general feeling of humanity that prevailed among all classes in this country, and they did not confine that statement to the laity and the unlearned, but extended it to those who were actually practising the pursuit of scientific inquiry and research in connection with the medical profession, and the general result of the inquiry that had taken place was, that among those persons who performed scientific experiments and carried on medical investigations there was a general feeling of humanity prevailing. The Secretary of the Cruelty to Animals Society gave his opinion, in which he said that he readily acknowledged that he had discovered no single case of wanton cruelty committed during experiments for scientific purposes; and that anesthetics were used where it was consistent with the success of the experiment. It was therefore only just to the scientific world and to the medical profession to adopt the view of the Commissioners not only as to the general tendency to humane feelings which prevailed among the laity, but among those who pursued the investigations in question. A great distinction must be drawn between the way in which those matters had been treated abroad and in this country. He believed that a

highest quarters-he spoke especially of foreign countries-cruelties had been practised by scientific persons, and it would be found in the Report that Dr. Sharpey spoke of "that infamous experiment of Majendie," while Dr. Car

great deal of the horror and strong feel- | There was no question that even in the ing that had arisen was caused by what had taken place abroad; but in this country there had been very few of these cruel experiments practised, though at the same time there had been a strong feeling, no doubt, that the tendency to make experiments of the kind was grow-penter mentioned that in experiments he ing in this country, and that some con- had witnessed cases of "perfect calloustrol should be put upon it with a view ness to animal suffering." Another to prevent those horrid practices here celebrated person said that he had no which were but too frequent abroad. regard for the sufferings of the animals The feeling of the scientific world upon experimented upon; he had no time to the matter was well shown by a series think of that whilst conducting the exof resolutions which were passed at a periment, his only object being to permeeting of the British Association which form the experiment and to learn as was held at Edinburgh in 1871. The much from it as possible. It should be resolutions were passed by men of great borne in mind that it was not intended eminence in the scientific world directly that they should legislate for the best interested in the subject, and they said class of persons who performed these that no experiment which could be per- experiments in this country, but for formed under the influence of anæsthe- those who might be tempted to make tics should be otherwise performed; that these experiments without proper knowno painful experiment was justifiable for ledge and without any definite object, the mere purpose of illustrating a law and also without proper appliances, and or fact already demonstrated; that when- without that general instruction which ever it was necessary for the investiga- was absolutely necessary to justify the tion of a new truth to make a painful making of such an experiment. It experiment, every effort should be made should be remembered that it had been that the sufferings inflicted should be as reported that many of these experiments little and as brief as possible; that every had been made for no purpose that effort should be made to ensure success could possibly merit the name of legitiin order that the suffering inflicted might mate scientific research." It should also not be wasted; that for that reason no be borne in mind that they were legispainful experiment ought to be per- lating not simply as against one class, formed by unskilled persons, or with but rather that they were endeavouring insufficient instruments or assistance, or to put in practice and carry out simply in a place not suited for that purpose; the resolutions of the British Associaand that operations ought not to be tion. He would say one word with reperformed on living animals for the gard to those persons who wished that mere purpose of attaining greater pro- these practices should not continue at fessional dexterity. In those resolutions all. Any one who read the Report they had a law which, if properly car- would see that so far as the prolongaried out and enforced, would greatly tion of human life and the mitigation of mitigate the evils arising from the prac- human suffering were concerned, much tice referred to, and they at all events had been learned by experiments of showed that the tendency of those gen- this kind; and if we were permitted to tlemen was towards humanity, and that inflict pain at all upon dumb animals, it nothing was further from their minds surely must be allowed for the attainthan the needless infliction of pain. It ment of objects like these. He did not might, then, be asked, if such was the mean that every experiment that took general tendency of those by whom the place could possibly be expected to add investigations were carried on, what was to the result to which he had alluded. the need of legislation at all? Well, The Commissioners reported that it was the fact of those resolutions having been impossible to prevent experiments upon passed showed the necessity of some re-living animals for the attainment of gulation being laid down, and there could be no security that the resolutions or anything like them would be regarded or enforced unless there was legislation.

knowledge which would be applicable to the mitigation of human suffering or the prolongation of human life; and that even if we could do so, we should thereby

drive our students to foreign countries. | any such exhibition. Now, who was to Absolute prevention, also, if possible, give the certificates that would be rewould not be reasonable if the greatest benefit as to human suffering could be derived from such experiments. Her Majesty's Government joined in those conclusions, and with no wish to throw any stigma or slur upon any one who practised medical science, he must still say that we must do something to prevent those things happening in England that undoubtedly had happened abroad; and the object of the Bill was to place under necessary, but under no unnecessary, control or restriction those who should perform experiments. Now, let them see how the Bill would work. The principle upon which it went was, that persons should not perform experiments on living animals calculated to give pain, except under the restrictions laid down in the Bill. The first restriction was, that they should be performed with the view only of the attainment of new discoveries in physiology, or knowledge that would tend to the prolongation of human life, or the mitigation of human suffering. It then provided that the experiments should be made in some registered place and by persons who had licences-with an exception he would shortly mention the animal being during the whole experiment under the influence of anesthetics of sufficient power to prevent it having pain; and that if the experiment was concluded before the power of the anæsthetic ceased, the animal should be destroyed. Then again the experiment was not to be performed in a hospital or lecture-room, and must not be performed for the obtainment of manual skill. A general licence would be refused for any experiment, but if for special reasons that could be shown it were refused to perform an experiment without anæsthetics, then a special licence would be required. Again, if experiments were necessary, not for the definite purpose of obtaining knowledge which would tend to the alleviation of human suffering, or the prolongation of life, but with a view to test the truth of some alleged discovery, for these, too, special licences would be required, and it was provided that in no case should there be any public exhibition of these experiments. Nothing could be more demoralizing than such an exhibition, and therefore there was an absolute prohibition of

quired under the Bill? Practically they would be given by the Secretary of State; but no one could apply for any licence, certainly not for any special licence, except on the recommendation of the heads of the learned Bodies named in the Bill. That was practically the whole of the Bill, except Clause 5, which was framed to prevent experiments being performed upon certain animals, such as dogs and cats, without there being special certificates, and also a provision for inspection. The House was aware that the measure had been much discussed in "another place," and before the Medical Council; and on one occasion when it was discussed by the latter Body the discussion lasted three days, and the result of the discussions had been that without infringing on the principles of the Bill, certain modifications might be made in it which would not at all interfere with what the Government really wanted to do. The first proposition which he had to make was as to the registered places. No doubt, every place where public instruction should be given should be registered; but it was provided that every person who had a licence should also register the place where the experiment was to be performed. Now, it had been represented according to the fact that many of the highest and most eminent men in their Professionsthe most fitted, probably, to perform those experiments-had no special places wherein to do so, and they felt not unnaturally that there was some indignity placed upon them if they were to have their private residences registered-a fact which would give a totally false impression as to their practices. After consulting many persons, therefore, he had come to the conclusion that whilst every place for the performance of experiments for the purpose of instruction should absolutely be registered, it should in all other cases be left to the Secretary of State, in granting the licences, to say that in such cases the private residence need not be registered. Then, again, as to experiments on dogs and cats. One great objection raised was, that persons performing experiments would always have to go for a special certificate when they wanted to touch these animals. There was no doubt that there were certain ex