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Mr. Rose entered into an account of the duties and emoluments of the admiralty register, and other offices, and denied that parliament had been in the habit of resuming grants made by the sovereign.

Mr. G. Johnstone supported the bill.

Sir S. Romilly thought it extremely desirable that the bill should undergo further consideration before it passed. He allowed Mr. Perceval might have no intention of benefiting himself by the bill, when he framed it; but the fact was, that the registrar would have the use of the suitors money if it passed into a law. Many instances had occurred in other courts of law, where officers so entrusted with the suitors money had applied it in speculations whereby the greatest injuries occurred; and he trusted the house would not give a facility to other offices to do the same.

The Solicitor General defended his right hon. friend from the imputation of having a personal interest in view by the present bill. He was surprised and alarmed to hear it asserted that the crown, or parliament, had a right to resume grants formerly made by the crown to individuals; if such a doctrine were admitted, it would shake the titles of some of the first families in the country to their real estates.

The bill, with its amendments was ordered to be engrossed, and read a third time to-day.

On the motion for the house going Into a committee on the poor settlement bill,

Mr. Whitbread moved as an a mendment, that the house should go into the same committee this day three months, which was after a short conversation agreed to.

Friday, June 15.

SOUTHWARK PETITION.

Mr. H. Thornton presented a petition from a numerous meeting of the inhabitants of Southwark, regularly called, in favour of Parliamen

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Mr. Brougham rose, pursuant to notice, to call the attention of the house to the state of the slave trade; a subject, he said, of the first importance; and though it was neither a personal nor a party question; though it touched rather no higher than the honour of the country and the house, and the interests of humanity, he trusted it would receive that favourable consideration which it had before experienced. The question was, what steps could be taken to watch over the execution of the sentence which the house had pronounced? It was four years since Mr. Fox made his last motion in

that house, and his last speech there, he believed, in favour of the abolition. Since he proposed a resolution pledging the house to the abolition of the traffic, and an address to the crown to procure the concurrence of foreign states in the same great object. An address to the same effect was agreed to in the ●ther house with equal unanimity and next year two noble friends of his (Grenville and Grey) followed up these preliminary steps, and by their exertions, second only to those of the member for Yorkshire, who was prevented by indisposition from attending this day, the abolition bill passed. That measure, which had been so long retarded, as some thought from the slowness with which truth made its way, or, as others imagined, from the want of zeal in its official supporters, experiented none of the obstacles which it formerly met with, and passed by a majority greater, perhaps, than was ever witnessed on an important contested question. The friends of the abolition, however, never expected that an act of parliament would at once put an end to a traffic, which bad been carried on so long and had taken such a deep root. But both be and others had certainly overrated the effects of the act, and under-rated the wickedness of the slave trader, and the infatuation of the planter. What had already been done had not been sufficient to answer the purpose. He hoped then that the house would favour him with its attention, while from the papers on the table, and whatever private information he had been able to procure, he laid before it a statement, which would in some measure enable it to appreciate the extent of the evil, and to apply the proper remedy.

He then proceeded to call the attention of the house to the state of the slave trade in foreign countries -in Spain, Portugal and America.

The extent of the slave trade of Spain, he could not state very accurately-but from returns of the custom-house at Cadiz, and from the extensive cultivation of sugar in one of the Spanish colonies, it appeared to be very great. The average of the importation of thirteen years, before 1803, was 5800 slaves per annum; and it was an increasing average, for that of the last four years was 8600. This proved what influence the American flag had in covering this traffic, since, after the commencement of hostilities between Spain and this couutry, the trade could only have been carried to a very limited extent in Spanish bottoms. With regard to the Portu guese slave trade he could speak with more precision. He had himself been informed, by a man of rank in that country, who had been governor of the Brazils, and was going out to Africa, that the annual importation from the Portuguese African settlements to the Brazils, amounted to upwards of 15,000, and that this was considered to be about one half of the whole of their slave trade; and he had been informed, from another quarter of great authority, that the whole annual amount was by no means overrated at 30,000. But the greatest branch of the slave trade was certainly carried on in American vessels. He firmly believed, as he had before stated, when the circumstance had been called in question by a right hon. gentleman opposite (Mr. Canning), that the American government acted with the most perfect sincerity. All the states except two, Georgia and South Carolina, had early abolished the traffic; and congress, as soon as it could do it conformably to the American constitution, in the beginning of the year 1808, had radically abolished the trade. But it was one thing to pass a law, and another to carry. it into execution; and though the

American legislature and government had done all in their power, it required much greater naval means than they possessed to suppress the contraband slave trade; and by their means, not only the Spanish and Portuguese, but even our own colonies, were supplied. Thus the foreign slave trade interfered with our own abolition.

What he intended to propose was, that the executive should be exhorted to take some further steps to promote the object of the legislature. Unless the American flag could, by some means or other, be excluded, and unless the Spanish and Portuguese could be brought to some arrangement, the trade would still be car ried on.

A large island of our own was within a night's sail of Cuba, the Spanish slave colony. When the large island of Trinidad and our colony of Guiana, were so much in want of slaves, and within a few hours sail of the Spanish slave market, the trade being still lawful in Spain and Portugal, how could it beexpected that our abolition should be effectual? A gentleman of his profession, lately from Berbice, had informed him, that the mode in which it was carried on was this, the Spanish slave ships entered the Oroonoko, and then our traders fitted out large boats from Trinidad on the North, and Guinea on the South, filling each boat with seventy negroes, gaining our settlements, in a short time, and landing the slaves before it was possible for the most vigilant officer to prevent them. This single fact shewed the necessity of forming some arrangement with the Spanish government on this subject, while the friendly relations between the two countries continued. The great argument he had heard in opposition to this was, what can we do? Those nations are wedded to their prejudices and we cannot interfere. Of this argument he had great suspicion, and for this reason, that it

was on this question alone that he had heard of our want of activity and influence in the councils of our neighbours. On all other subjects, some of doubtful policy, we were ready to intrigue-to fight to subsidize. On this unhappy subject alone we not only lost our influence and activity, but we were anxious to say that we had neither influence nor activity. We had never failed when the object was to obtain fresh colonies and to encourage this trade, and therefore he looked upon our failure when the object was to abolish with some suspicion; he sus pected it might arise from there being something in our exertions perfectly sincere, but very coldwithout any ill-will to the cause, but at the same time without a spark of zeal. His answer then to-What can we do was,-How had we contrived to promote the slave trade when that was the object. He would only desire one-tenth part of the zeal in favour of the abolition which had once been crerted in extending the traffic. If he were asked where our efforts should be directed, he should say to Spain and Portugal. both we had done much, and a dispostion to come to an arrangement on this subject might be expected. The only Spanish colony where slaves were in much request was Cuba, where the sugar cane was extensively cultivated. On the main land there was but little demand for slaves : about 1400 were annually sent to Buenos Ayres, 500 to Peru, and 100 to Mexico, while Cuba received 8600 annually. This, then, was the only Spanish colony which would suffer, and it was reasonable to expect that the Spanish government would not refuse so small a sacrifice.

Adverting then to the means to be employed with America, he admitted that our influence there was not so powerful, but he would throw out one or two remarks for the consideration of the ministers-1st, A■

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attempt ought to be made to supply the deficiency of the American naval means, and he suggested that an arrangement should be made by which our cruizers might be enpowered to capture the American slave vessels, while the American Cruizers should be allowed to capture our contraband slave vessels. Their contraband ships were many, and our cruizers were numerous, and by this arrangement we would give up only a little and acquire a great deal. From some conversation with persons of high station from America, he had some reason to believe that such an arrangement would not be objected to." would also be for the advantage of our own planters, since, if foreigners should carry on the traffic while it was prohibited here, the planter would be subjected to a temporary pressure, as the foreigner might for a time undersell him in the sugar market. Another circumstance, with regard to American ships, he threw out for the consideration of merchants. It appeared to him that the experiment of capturing the American slave vessels might be safely made. He had some reason to believe that no reclamation would be made if such vessels were condemned, whatever might be their numbers. A claim would be preferred indeed by individuals, and the court had been in the habit of saying, that it would not meddle with the municipal laws of other countries.--But then the court required that they should have some property in the vessels. and he wanted to see whether by the law of nations there was any such thing as property in men,-in human flesh. He was sure this was not warranted by the laws of nature, and he found no authority for it in the law of nations. He wished to see the question tried. In his own opinion, and in the opinions of others of the professionwith whom he had conversed, there could be no serious

risk in such captures. If condemnation did not follow it was impossible, under the circumstances, that costs and damages should be allowed. The captors might do infinite good with very little or no risk.

Having stated the manner in which foreigners carried on the traffic, he came with great pain to the evasions of the abolition act in this country. All the various means which the ingenuity of unprincipled avarice had been able to suggest, had been a dopted for that purpose. Vessels were fitted out at Liverpool, as if for innocent traffic with Africa. The cargoes, for the most part, were the same as those carried out for the purchase of gold dust and ivory. That part which was necessary for the slave ships was concealed so as to elude the search of the officers. The vessels wanted the bulk-head, &c. which was the distinguishing marks of slave ships. Having got to scu, and cleared the channel by four days' sale; the carpenters set to work with planks previously prepared, to fit the vessel for the reception of slaves. For better concealment, some of the sailors were Portugueze, and some times the master. But the never failing mark was, that in some capacity or other an ancient hoary slave trader was always to be found aboard, by whose cunning they were enabled to escape detection! Mr. Brougham then called the attention of the house to the record of the condemnation of the Commercia Deshio, a large vessel which had been seized in the river, by means of a friend of his, who having held a high situation in Sierra Leone, was acquainted with the arts of the slave traders, and had submitted to the pain of a voyage for the purpose of more completely exposing them. He gave a list of the contents of the vessel, which proved the object for which she had been fitted out. Having mentioned the number of guns, the stock of provisions, &c. he stated 55 dozen of padlocks, 197 iron s/ac:

kles for the feet, 93 pair of hand-cuffs, &c. and for 800 slaves in a long voyage, out of their vast humanity, one small medicine chest, value 51. sterling! The vessel was fitted out with British capital, and he believed insured here. He had before menuoned that six vessels had been fitted out by a detestable series of crimes at one single port of this country.

It was now three years since that traffic had been abolished by law, and therefore he might indulge now in an expression of feeling, which delicacy before rendered it proper to suppress. The slave traders were not only like other smugglers employed in the violation of law, but were engaged in the pursuit of crimes, and to call them traders or merchants was an abuse of the term. He would not deem so lightly of trade so calculaed to promote humanity and civilization, so alienated in its nature from murder and rapine, and flourishing most by peace and fair dealing; he would not deem so lightly of it as to call those traders and and merchants, who still dared to be guilty of the worst of crimes for the basest of possible purposes.-He could conceive some palliations for murder, for piracy, for public robbery, &c. Revenge might be palliated, and the boldness with which the pirate and the robber exposed themselves, threw a sort of gloss over their crimes. But these subor ners of murder employed others as bad as themselves, except that they were not so cowardly. They ought no longer to be called traders, but LIVERPOOL suborners of piracy and

assassination.

Before he concluded, he wished to ask, whether it was not possible to execute our own law better? For that purpose he suggested, first, that we should endeavour to obtain the cession of a Portugueze island, for some years, or perpetuity, which stood in the middle of our own African coast. This would put in our

VOL. VIII.

possession a range of 500 miles. Secondly, The number of cruizers on the African coast was too scanty; the cruizers ought to be sent to Africa, and not to America. The slaveships were under the necessity of remaining there for six or eight weeks, to get cargoes, and had less chance of escape. The cruizers ought to be light vessels, with a great number of boats, to follow the slave-ships into the creeks. Six or seven vessels could hardly be better employed, and only for a short time. If the trade were once rooted out, it would not readily commence again. The industry and capital of these people must find some other channel. Some would engage, perhaps, in piracy, while others took the highway, so that the law might at length dispose of them. All means of stopping the trade were as nothing compared with what might arise from the feelings of mankind, when its nature and effects should be impartially considered. He should have called the attempt to stop it by pecuniary penalty as absurd if the law had gone farther. When it was observed how easily acts of parliament might be passed, making those acts capital to which the mind had been long accustomed; when the difficulty experienced by an honourable and learned friend of his in doing away the capital part from the stealing of five shillings was considered; when it was remarked that Lord Ellenborough by one act, for which he honoured him, created twelve capital offences; when forgeries were so severely punished, while the opportunities and temptations to commit it were so numerous, could any one hesitate to say that this ought to be punished as a felony? Adverting again to the record before-mentioned, he calculated the value of the ship's expences of a voyage, &c. at 20,0001. 800 negroes at 1001. per head, the present price, would produce 80,0001. Here then would be a profit of

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