cidents constantly occurring. He knew an instance of a poor man, who had saved up a sum of money, from the fruits of his labour, which was in the shape of Bank notes, and which he had deposited in a cupboard in his room. On going to seek for it afterwards, however, he found that his notes, as well as his bread and cheese, had been eaten by the rats. The noble lord concluded by declaring his dissent from every principle of the Bill. He would propose as an amendment," That the Report be brought up that day six months." Mr. Simeon opposed the amendment. Sir John Newport deprecated the interference of the legislature in cases of this kind; as it only afforded to the ministers of the day a temporary relief from their embarrassments, and went to subvert all principles of political economy. Mr. M Naghten thought it but fair that the Irish tenantry should have as much protection as the English. Lord A. Hamilton proposed a clause to confine the dividend of profits to the proprietors of the Bank of England to 10. per cent. during the operation of the Bill. His object was that the Bank might have an interest in the recommencement of payments in specie. This clause was opposed by Mr. Manning and Mr. Vansittart, and supported by Mr. Brougham; but it was negatived without a division. Mr. Taylor proposed a clause to compel the Bank to employ the surplus, above 10l. per cent. to the purchase of bullion, which was also negatived, after some important discussion. Mr. Johnstone proposed a clause to limit the issue of Bank notes, which was likewise negatived.-The Bill was then recommitted. The Chancellor of the Exchequer proposed what he termed a valuable amendment, taking away from the landlord the right of ejectment after a tender of Bank notes in Mr. Johnstone spoke against the Report payment of his rent by the tenant. It was being brought up. He said the Bill would warmly opposed by Messrs. Horner, be destructive of public credit; and the Brougham, and others, on the ground that only difference between us and foreign it was a most important alteration, deprivnations was, that they bounded into bank-ing the landlord of his only remaining reruptcy in three or four years, while we should be longer in doing so; but say what ministers would, it must come to the same end at last. Mr. Vansittart was favourable to the Report being brought up. He said, we were no doubt in a state of difficulty and embarrassment, but denied that Bank notes were at all depreciated. He believed a great majority of the House approved of the Bill, and a much greater majority of the nation; and therefore it had his hearty support. Mr. Horner, at considerable length, opposed the general principle of the Bill. The invariable effect of legislative interference was to increase, rather than diminish the evil. The root of the evil, the excessive issue of Bank notes, ought to be struck at. The rate of exchange was now, in consequence of the measures taken by government, lower than at the time the Bullion Committee sat. He remarked upon the extraordinary coincidence, that the rise in the price of bullion exactly kept pace with the augmented issue of notes from Threadneedle-street. A division then took place on the question that the Report be brought up, when the numbers were-Ayes 138; Noes 29. The Report was accordingly received, when medy, and making Bank notes to all intents and purposes legal tender. The Chancellor of the Exchequer and Mr. Simeon maintained a contrary position, insisting that nothing new in principle was suggested, and indeed that the alteration had been in contemplation from the commencement. The amendment was passed without a division; the Report was brought up, received, agreed to, and the Bill ordered to be read a third time to-morrow. HOUSE OF LORDS. Tuesday, April 21. PETITIONS AGAINST THE ORDERS IN COUNCIL.] The Duke of Norfolk presented a Petition from certain manufacturers, traders, and others, of the town of Birmingham, against the continuance of the Orders in Council, which was ordered to lie on the table. Earl Füzwilliam presented a Petition to the same eflect, from the body of merchants, manufacturers, and other loyal inhabitants of the town of Sheffield, in the county of York, and its vicinity. The Petition expressed, in strong language, the opinion of the petitioners respecting these measures, and praying their lordships to adopt such measures as in their wisdom they may deem proper for the purpose of | It would, in fact, be to open the ports of rescinding the same. Lord Calthorpe presented a second Petition, precisely to the same effect from Birmingham. The Duke of Norfolk took occasion to observe, that the Petition just presented had received the signatures of more than 14,000 individuals, and urged the propriety of their lordships paying the most serious attention to a subject of such vital importance, and respecting which the sense of such a large portion of their fellow subjects was so decidedly expressed. Earl Fitzwilliam then adverted to the notice he had given of a motion respecting the Orders in Council, with reference to the numerous Petitions which crowded the table of the House, setting forth the distresses of the manufacturers in consequence of the operation of these Orders, and moved to discharge the order for summoning their lordships on that motion on Tuesday next, and to renew it for Thursday the 30th instant. The Earl of Lauderdale observed, that the various applications to parliament upon this important subject, strongly expressed the opinions and the feelings of the great body of those most interested in and affected by the measures in question. What they alleged against those ruinous measures was strictly founded in fact, and this he would be the more enabled to prove, were the documents which he should move for on Friday ordered to be produced. The petitioners took a right view of the subject, and he agreed with them, as he was sure that no measures could more effectually aid the enemy than the means afforded by those Orders in Council. They would tend eventually to the creation of a marine for the enemy, and would, instead of diminishing, tend to increase the supplies for those armies with which he subjugated the continent. He conjured their lordships to attend to the subject, when it should, ere long, come under their consideration, as involving points not only vitally affecting the commercial and trading interests, but even the national existence of the country itself. Earl Bathurst strongly contended that a very mistaken and erroneous sense of the nature and effect of the Orders in Council was entertained by those whose opinions were expressed in the language they had just heard read. He would put it to their lordships what would be the inevitable effect of a repeal of the Orders in Council? France to importations from the Baltic, from the United States of America, and various other places; it would be to transfer the entire advantages of a traffic to the enemy, which might otherwise direct itself to this country. The Earl of Lauderdale insisted that the petitioners in such a question were the preferable authority. The Duke of Montrose deprecated all: premature discussion of a subject not before the House. He contended that the opinions of noble lords on his side of the House were intitled to as much attention and respect as those so loudly urged by the noble earl. The line of argument and tone held by noble lords opposite, tended to deceive, instead of informing the manufacturers upon the subject. They represented that the effect of the British Orders in Council was to benefit the trade and the navigation of the enemy, and to divert the tide of commerce from the ports of this island. His conception of those measures was very different. He regarded them as making part of a wise and just system of retaliation against the unprincipled and aggressive conduct of France, providing that where the neutral had not the wisdom or spirit to defend its right, the enemy should not reap the advantage of commerce, nor that the valuable products of the West Indies should be carried into his ports. The number of speeches which were made, nor the clamour which was raised against these measures, did not alter the nature of those Orders, or tend in the least to shew their want of wisdom or justice. RENEWAL OF THE EAST INDIA COMPANY'S CHARTER.] Earl Grey, adverting to the numerous Petitions that lay on their lordships' table, against the East India monopoly, wished to know from the noble President of the Board of Controul, when the subject of the renewal of the charter was to be brought forward. The session was far advanced; the measure was one of the greatest importance; and it was necessary that time should be given for that ample deliberation, which the magnitude of the question called for. The Earl of Buckinghamshire could not state exactly when the subject would be brought before parliament; but whether it could be brought forward this session or not, their lordships might be assured of this, that full time would be given for the consideration of the question in all its bearings. He had no objection, however, to state, that it was the intention of government that the matter should originate in the other House; but there was no desire, on the part of the Prince Regent's ministers, to precipitate the measure, or prevent its being maturely considered in both Houses. Earl Grey had expressed his wish to know when the subject would be brought before their lordships; whether it was probable that it would be submitted to them at a period when there was a fair chance of its being considered and discussed in a manner suited to its importance: but now the noble earl over the way appeared to be uncertain whether it would come before them at all that session; and stated, that, at all events, it was intended that the measure should not ori ginate there. He saw no reason against it; but at any rate it ought to be laid before them at a period when it might receive the fullest deliberation. Could this be expected? Considering the time that a Bill of this nature must take in passing through the other House, it was morally impossible that it should that session come before their lordships at a time when there was usually the fullest attendance. He hoped their lordships would interfere, and not suffer their dignity and consequence in the state to be thus trifled with. The Earl of Buckinghamshire had given no decided opinion that the subject ought not to originate in their lordships' House. He had only stated that under the circumstances, it appeared most advisable to the government that the matter should originate in the other House. Lord Grenville declared, that from what he had seen of the conduct of the present ministers, it was his firm belief that they acted upon a fixed intention to annihilate the consequence of that House. (Some cries of No, no.) He repeated that such was his firm belief-a belief founded upon their uniform plan of delaying to bring the most important political measures before their lordships, till it was notoriously impossible to give them their due consideration in that House. The declaration of his noble friend at the head of the East India Department, was in exact conformity to this system. After the public attention had been so long fixed upon this subject, when their table was loaded with Petitions respecting it, his noble friend had declared, that the matter was not to be brought forward here till it had passed the other House. Such a declaration he thought a most extraordinary one; for even if the measure were to originate in the other House, still there were means, before it had gone through all its forms, to bring the subject before their lordships; and this was the plan which those who loved the constitution of their country, and thought their lordships' House an integral part of it, would, in all probability, have followed but ministers, it appeared, thought that their lordships had only to sit, with their hands folded, till the most important measures were brought before them, at a time when they could not give them due consideration; and then, if some of their lordships solicited farther time, they would be told, that the public interest, and not their opinions, were to be attended to. : Was this a way to treat that House? For five years they had been treating on the subject with their parliament in Leadenhall-street; and yet it was not to be brought before their lordships, till it was so late, that they could not conveniently, he might say, could not possibly, give it the consideration which its magnitude required. It was of the utmost importance to the constitution of the country, that their lordships should not suffer their House to be treated with this gross indignity. The Earl of Liverpool would never hear the present ministers charged with treating their lordships' House with indignity, without rising to repel the accusation. He maintained that in the conduct of the public business, every attention had been paid to the consequence of that House. What was there in the explanation of his noble friend to call for this accusation? Had not his noble friend declared, that ample time would be given for the consideration of this important subject? And with regard to the particular period at which this business might come before them, he had to observe, that no season was improper for deliberation upon great public measure. If, indeed, there had been any faulty delay on the part of ministers, under all the circumstances of the case, that might be a ground for a distinct charge against them: but any season of the year was a fit one for the discussion of a great political question. It would be for their lordships to decide, when the question came before them, whether they should proceed upon it or adjourn the discussion to a future period; a 505] Petitions respecting the Claims of the Roman Catholics. APRIL 21, 1812. and it ought to be remembered, that the Company's Charter wanted two years of its expiration. Where was the indignity to their lordships, in saying that it was the intention of ministers that the measure should originate in the other House? That might be purely a matter of convenience; and no indignity was intended to either House of Parliament. It ought to be remembered, also, that when the subject of the Charter, now about to expire, was under consideration, the noble lord who spoke last was in administration; and yet the measure had then originated in the other House, and had come before their lordships at a late period of the session. The magnitude of the subject was deeply felt by the Prince Regent's servants; and they had thought it their duty to consider fully the various interests which it involved, before they laid the matter before parliament. They had thought it incumbent on them to lay the measure before parliament in as perfect a shape as possible; and it was, and had always been, their intention that parliament should have ample time to give it all the consideration which its importance deserved. Marquis Wellesley denied, in the most pointed terms, that there was any intention on the part of ministers, while he was connected with them, to offer any indignity to their lordships' House, or to treat its authority lightly; but at the same time he deeply regretted, that a question of this importance; for it was one of the most important questions, not only with a view to trade; but in a constitutional, military, and political point of view, that ever came under their lordships' reviewit involved all that was dearest and most vital to the constitution of this country, to its liberties, and to its government,-it involved the consideration of all they owed to that vast empire which they had so long administered, and which, as he should be able to prove when the matter came regularly under discussion, they had, all things considered, administered so well; he deeply regretted, he repeated, that a question of this vast importance had not, before this late period of the session, been brought regularly under the deliberation of both Houses, in the shape of Resolutions, by which the opinion of parliament might be taken on the prominent features and principles of the system, before the more formal measure was submitted for deliberation. Whether the measure ought to originate in that or the other House, [506 whether that House had been, at any time, PETITIONS RESPECTING THE CLAIMS OF THE ROMAN CATHOLICS.] The Duke of Gloucester.-My lords, I hold in my hand a Petition, which as Chancellor of the University of Cambridge, I feel it incumbent on me to present to your lordships; but having uniformly absented myself whenever the Roman Catholic question has been under discussion, and abstained from giving any opinion on that subject, I request it may be understood, that though my name appears at the head of this Petition, in consequence of the high office I have the honour of filling in the University, from which I have but a few hours since received this Petition, (an office I feel the greatest pride in possessing) yet I do not mean to pledge myself to any opinion either for or against the important question, upon which your lordships are this night going to deliberate. Nothing would have induced me to come down on the present occasion, but for the very high respect I entertain for that very learned body whose Petition I hold in my hand; and I propose leaving the House as soon as I have heard it read. The Petition being read and ordered to lie on the table, The Earl of Hardwicke said; My lords, from the relation I have the honour to bear to the University of Cambridge, it is impossible that I should not feel some anxiety to trouble your lordships with a few words in consequence of the Petition which has been just read. None can be more ready than I am to admit the weight that is due to every thing that proceeds from that learned body; at the same time, my lords, with all the respect that I bear to the University collectively, and with all the respect and regard that I feel for many of the individuals, who probably are parties to this Petition, I trust I may be permitted to remark, that the weight which is given to any act, from whatever quarter it proceeds, must necessarily bear some proportion to the degree of deliberation and discussion which it has undergone. Now, my lords, I am sorry to be under the necessity of observing that this Petition, though relating to a question of great importance to the state, is not the result of that consideration to which the subject is certainly intitled. On the contrary, it is a fact which cannot be denied, that the intention of proposing any Petition at all, was not known in the University on the evening before the day (viz. yesterday) on which it was proposed in the senate; and if a right reverend prelate were now in his place, he would confirm what I now state to your lordships, that though presiding over the largest college in the University, he was not apprised till the evening of the day before yesterday, that any such measure was in contemplation. And, yet, my lords, with all this secrecy, the majority in favour of the Petition was very inconsiderable. In the Black-hood House, which consists of masters of arts, above five years standing, the members were, for the Petition 24, against it 19; and in the White-hood House, for a Petition 34, against it 20. It must here be observed, that the circumstances of the doctors having the privilege of voting in the White-hood House, if they think proper to do so, accounts for the majority being greater than in the Black-hood House. Under these circumstances, my lords, I certainly cannot consider this Petition as conveying the sense of the University at large; but at all events, it will receive its due weight from your lordships; and I am bound to say, that many of the individuals from whom it proceeds, are of the most respectable description for their abilities and learning, and would not have brought before your lordships any Petition that was not expressive of their genuine and sincere opinions upon this or any other subject. I am, therefore, sincerely concerned to find myself obliged to differ from them so entirely upon this occasion; but I cannot, in deference to any individuals, or any body, however respectable, abandon opinions which are the result of much consideration and long experience; opinions so far as relates to the penal laws, entertained from a very early period of life, confirmed by observation and reflection since, and which lead me to the more decided conviction of the wisdom and policy of supporting the motion that will be the subject of our deliberation tonight. The Marquis of Lansdowne.-My lords, as far as my information goes, the statement of my noble friend, notwithstanding the length of time in which the subject had occupied the public attention, though nearly two months notice have been given in both Houses of the intention to press this question upon the consideration of parliament this session; yet it was not till Saturday last that it was surmised in the University that such a Petition as this was in contemplation; and it was not till Sunday, a day usually devoted to other concerns, that the promoters of the Petition formally promulgated their purposes. The subject was discussed on Monday morning, before those who were necessarily absent on various duties, could attend in their places, to give their concurrence or intimate their dissent. I know that several persons, if they had had timely notice of the intention to submit this proposition to the University, would have attended to give their negative to it. (Hear, hear.) I have authority to state, that if the reverend and learned prelate, who held the highest situation in the University, next to the illustrious person whom it has the honour to have at its head, had not been accidentally absent when the Petition was proposed, he would have given it his opposition. Such are the circumstances under which this Petition has been carried; and I request your lordships to bear in mind the statement of my noble friend, that only fifty-eight persons out of the houses that voted, had supported the proposition, belonging to a body of seven or eight hundred. The Duke of Norfolk.-I think that the |