DEC. 30, 1829.]

Distribution of Public Lands.

[H. of R.

Mr. C. made some other remarks upon the merits of the longation could do no possible good. Mr. P. said he purbill, and took his seat. posely abstained from entering himself into the discussion Mr. STORRS, of New York, made some remarks, of the merits of the proposition before the House, having which we are accidentally prevented from reporting at risen principally for the purpose of moving to lay this relarge, but the general object of which was to show how solution on the table, with the understanding that it should inapplicable and incorrect a test the post office account of not be called up again at the present session. distances would be. Mr. BUCHANAN, of Pennsylvania, asked the gentleAfter a few observations from Mr. STERIGERE, vin- man from Tennessee to withdraw this motion, (which by dicating his amendment from Mr. WICKLIFFE'S objec-rule admits of no debate,) to allow him to make a few obtions to it, servations.

The House adjourned.

WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER, 30, 1829.
DISTRIBUTION OF PUBLIC LANDS.

The House resumed the consideration of the resolution moved by Mr. HUNT, of Vermont, proposing to direct an inquiry by the Committee on the Public Lands into the expediency of distributing the nett proceeds of the sales of public lands among the several States for the purposes of education and internal improvement.

Mr. POLK said he would accommodate the gentleman with a great deal of pleasure, but the very object of his motion was to stop the debate.

The question on the motion of Mr. POLK to lay the resolution on the table, was then taken by yeas and nays, and was decided as follows-yeas 72, nays 95.

So the House refused to lay the resolution on the table. Mr. BUCHANAN then rose, and said, he felt himself indebted to the vote of the House, and not to the courtesy of the gentleman from Tennessee, [Mr. POLK] for the privilege of making a few observations on this subject. He The question being stated on agreeing to Mr. MAR- ought not perhaps to complain of that gentleman's course, TIN'S proposed amendment, for directing the committee because it was sanctioned by the rules of the House; yet to report the quantity of lands already granted to each he would say, it was not very liberal, after a member had State by the General Government, himself addressed the House upon a question, to conclude is remarks by making a motion, which, if successful, would prevent all others from making any reply to his argument.

Mr. POLK, of Tennessee, said, that, from the time which had been already occupied in the discussion of this resolution, proposing an inquiry merely, it must be evident not only that this discussion is premature, but that it The House [said Mr. B.] is placed in a singular posiis not likely to arrive at any profitable end. It was admit- tion in regard to this resolution. The course pursued by ted by those who supported the resolution, that it is not its friends has been unfortunate. Upon this resolution, expedient to make this distribution, at all events until the which merely proposes to institute an inquiry before a public debt shall have been paid. That the public debt committee of the House, the skilful tactics of the gentlewill not be paid for several years to come, was known to man from South Carolina [Mr. MARTIN] have involved every one, and therefore this discussion was premature. us in such a debate, as can only become proper in case Another reason against entertaining the resolution at pre- the committee should report a bill for the division of the sent, was, that the whole subject of the distribution of the nett proceeds of the public lands among the States in prosurplus revenue, after the payment of the public debt, portion to their population, and that bill should be before had been brought to the notice of Congress by the Presi- the House for discussion. Yet, in this preliminary stage dent of the United States, and was now under considera- of the business, we have been drawn off from the main tion before a committee of the House. When this whole subject of inquiry, and have been seriously engaged in dissubject was thus before one committee, why should this cussing the question, whether the new States, who have part of it be referred to another committee? Another hitherto received donations of public land from this Goreason against the present discussion was that, that if it vernment, shall account for them in the general distribushould be the policy of the country, after the public debt tion. The gentleman from South Carolina, who proposed was paid off, to levy more taxes than the Government this amendment, has frankly avowed, that, whether it preshould require for the ordinary administration of public vailed or not, he would vote against the resolution. Such affairs, and the question should be between the present is my regard for that gentleman, and of such value do I plan of internal improvement and the proposed plan for estimate his support, that I might be willing to sacrifice the distribution of the public revenue, he was free to say that, between the two modes, he should prefer the latter. But this was a question which it will be time enough to argue when it shall actually have arisen. It might be, possibly, that, when the public debt should have been paid off, there would be no surplus revenue, and no occasion for this absorbent process.

something of my own opinion to secure it; but when he proposes to amend our resolution, and informs us, at the same time, he will oppose it in every shape, we ought to view his amendment with jealousy and distrust.

"Timeo Danaos, et dona ferentes."

Without being drawn into an argument upon the subThere was still another reason why he thought that no ject, it is my decided opinion that it would be both unjust good would result from prolonging this discussion, and and ungenerous to charge the new States with donations that was, the course that this debate had taken. The of land which they have already received, and that an inamendment now under consideration involved a proposi- quiry into the expediency of such a measure could only tion to raise an account current between the States, tend to distract and divide the friends of the resolution. and the discussion of it could have no other effect What [said Mr. B.] is the true and the only proper ques than to produce an unnecessary excitement between tion for discussion at this time? It is, whether the subject members of the same family. With as much propriety of the resolution is of sufficient importance to demand inmight an account be raised of the money expenditure of quiry. Upon this question can a doubt be entertained? the General Government among the several States. Sup-The vast importance of the measure proposed must be impose it were proposed to instruct a committee to inquire pressed upon every mind, whether we regard its conseinto the amount of debts of the several States assumed by quences to the people of the old or of the new States of this the General Government at the date of the funding sys- Union. The public feeling of the country is alive to the tem, and strike a balance of account between them; what subject. And shall such of us as are friendly to its thoan excitement would it not produce! Gentlemen must rough investigation suffer inquiry to be stifled? I trust not. see [Mr. P. said] the labyrinth of difficulties into which this sort of discussion would lead them, and that its proVOL. VI.--62

The report of the select committee of the House, at the last session of Congress, has furnished us all the statis

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Distribution of Public Lands.

[DEC. 30, 1829.

tical information upon the subject which can be desired. of that committee, we have already received from the reThere are two important questions which that report does port of the select committee raised at the last session. not embrace, and which ought to be carefully investigated Mr. B. said he thought the present the peculiar and by a committee of this House. I desire to have a report the appropriate time for inquiry. The country were exfrom such a committee, upon the question whether the pecting, nay, they were demanding it. Are we prepared proceeds of the public lands are pledged in such a manner to stifle this inquiry? Are we prepared to declare that to the public creditors, that, without violating our faith, we do not think this important subject even worthy of a we cannot distribute them among the States until after reference? Such, he trusted, would never be the deterthe total extinguishment of the national debt. In the mination of the House; and he was convinced the friends course of the debate, the affirmative of this proposition of inquiry would never be diverted from their purpose, has been stated with a degree of confidence which would until they had obtained all the information necessary to almost seem to preclude doubt; and yet there are proba- enable them to act with wisdom.

bly strong reasons to sustain a contrary opinion.

Mr. B. said he would read a substitute for the resolu

It is very true, that, when the funding system was first tion proposed by the gentleman from Vermont, [Mr. established in 1790, the proceeds of the sales of the pub- HUNT] which was in accordance with the remarks he had lic lands were directed to be applied solely to the extin-just made. He trusted it would be acceptable to that guishment of the debt of the Revolution; but it is equally gentleman. He knew that, under the rules of the House, certain that this pledge was often disregarded. In the he could not at present offer it as an amendment; and if year 1817, when the present sinking fund was established, he could, he would not, because his time was already too all previous laws which had made appropriations for the much occupied on the committee of which he was already purchase or payment of the funded debt were repealed. a member, to make him desire to be placed on the select That fund of ten millions of dollars annually, for the dis- committee to which this subject ought in his opinion to be charge of the public debt, was to be raised from the im-referred. port and tonnage duties, from the internal duties, and from Here Mr. B. concluded by reading the following: the sales of Western lands. It may be [said Mr. B.] that Resolved, That a select committee be appointed, to the obligation imposed by this act will be equally satisfied, which shall be referred the report of a select committee whether the annual sinking fund shall be provided from made to the House of Representatives the 25th February one or from all these sources. Such was probably the last, relating to the distribution of the nett proceeds of opinion of Congress, when, in less than one year after they the sale of public lands among the several States, in prohad created this fund, they abolished all the internal du-portion to the population of each; and that the said comties, and thus cut off one of the sources from which it was mittee be instructed to inquire, and report to this House, to be supplied. I wish to express no decided opinion whether there be any provision of the constitution, or of upon this question; but it is certainly well worthy of in-any act or acts of Congress, in relation to the discharge vestigation by a committee. Its proper understanding and of the public debt, which ought to prevent Congress correct decision may aid us much in arriving at a just con- from making such distribution, and that the said commit. clusion in regard to the main question. tee have leave to report by bill or otherwise.

Mr. B. wished to be distinctly understood, that even if Mr. TEST, of Indiana, then rose to address the Chair. we could, consistently with the public faith, at once dis-Before he began, he was warned by the Speaker that it tribute the annual proceeds of the public lands among the was the question on the amendment which was before the States, he had not for himself determined whether it House, and he must confine his remarks to the question. would be expedient to do so until after the national debt Mr. TEST remarked that he thought he understood should be discharged. the question, and should endeavor to confine himself to

There is [said Mr. B.] another important question in it as nearly as he could, but he considered the original volved in this inquiry, on which I desire to have the re-proposition and amendment so connected together, that port of a committee; and that is in regard to the constitu- he could not do justice to the subject without a partial tional power of Congress to make the proposed distribu-notice of both. Coming from the part of the country tion among the States. The power to distribute the pro-where I do, [said Mr. T.] and where a question of this ceeds of the public lands among the States to which they kind so vitally affects the interests of my constituents, it now belong, is, in my opinion, very different from that of will be expected that I should say something upon the distributing among them the surplus revenue arising from subject. Indeed, I should think myself derelict from my taxation. I purposely refrain from entering upon the dis-duty if I were to remain silent. The amendment, sir, cussion of this question at present; but I think I might ap-looks forward to the general operation of the original repeal with confidence to the gentleman from South Caro- solution. I shall, therefore, be necessarily led into the lina, [Mr. MARTIN] whether there is not an obvious dis-examination of the principles of the latter, to come fairly tinction between the two cases. A gentleman might, with at the effects of the former. What, sir, is the question perfect consistency, admit the power of Congress in the before the House? The first or original proposition is to one case, and deny it in the other. appropriate the nett proceeds of the public lands towards Mr. B. said he thought this resolution ought not to be internal improvements and the promotion of learning, to referred to the Committee on the Public Lands, as the mo-be divided among the States according to their represen ver of it [Mr. HUNT] had proposed. Highly as he re-tation in Congress. The amendment offered by the gen spected that committee, it was well known they were chief- tleman from South Carolina proposes an inquiry into the ly selected from the members representing that portion of quantity and value of those lands, in order, as I under the Union within which the public lands were situated, stand it, to a division among the States, with a view to and who were therefore best acquainted with the laws come at a fair settlement as he calls it; and that those which related to them. The subject proposed to be re- States, who have received a portion of those lands, may ferred was one of deep and general interest to every State. be charged in the account current with what they have reIn his opinion, a select committee, composed of members ceived. It is necessary to look into the motive or consi from different portions of the Union, should be raised for deration which induced the State of Virginia, and others, the purpose of investigating it. The subject involved im-to cede their wild lands to the United States; and then to portant questions in regard to the construction of the con- see if the proposition now before the House is calculated stitution and of the laws of the country, which did not ap- to promote the grand object which those States had in propriately refer themselves to the Committee on the Public view when they made these cessions; and the determinaLands, and the information peculiarly within the province tion of this point will test the utility of the measure. It

DEC. 30, 1829.]

Distribution of Public Lands.

[H. of R.

is considered, on all hands, that one of the motives was Shall we make it at the minimum or maximum price? to enhance the resources of the Federal Government, Sir, I presume the gentleman would calculate them at the which were at that time very limited indeed, and to enable price which they sold for. I will gratify him in making it so: them to discharge their obligations to their creditors; but, then, suppose, by your appropriations and our labor, the sir, I am very far from believing this was the most promi- lands shall bring ten dollars per acre, do you gain nothing? nent or urgent motive. There were higher and more And the more labor we add to the appropriation, the more important considerations. The prime object of all was, it enhances the price, and we are to be charged at that to maintain and secure a continuation of the confedera- price. Sir, it amounts to this, the more labor we do, the tion. Virginia possessed almost as much territory as any more we have to pay; the more money you receive in contwo or three of the other States, and it was readily seen sequence of our improvements, the more we have to pay that, in a course of time, an increase of population must you-we could have purchased the land of you at the give her a vast ascendancy over the balance of them. minimum price, but in consequence of receiving it as a Looking with a philosophic eye through the course of donation (as the gentleman would call it) we have to pay events, it was not difficult to discern that the growing three prices. It is a valuable gift to you, but it beggars greatness of an individual State, already the most power-us-and I should say, take back your "Deganire," take ful in the confederation, would be calculated, in the very back your fatal gift, it is poisoned. Sir, it is like a man nature of things, to create fears and jealousies in the small-laying out a town, and selling his lots for a high price, and er States, which might, in time, grow into discontents and afterwards calling upon the purchasers to pay him for the bickerings, which, being fostered by those fears and jea- streets and alleys which he had laid out. You have been lousies, would lead directly to a dissolution of the Union cunning enough to give, and we silly enough to receive. or confederation. The prime motive, then, must have Sir, it is reversing the whole order of things; upon this been to provide against that event, by reducing the amount calculation the less we have of your gifts the better. Poor of territory in the larger States, and limiting their size as Indiana, there is a terrible day of reckoning coming; she near to an equality as possible, thereby to produce a ba- has been silly enough to receive some of your gifts; and lance of power in some measure like that of Europe. on the great day of reckoning, if it shall be found that Passing, for the sake of brevity, over all the intermediate she has received more than her share of the lands, she steps, and without adverting to further evidence, it must must pay up the balance; and how is she to do it? Sir, appear clear to any gentleman in the House, that that she never will do it, no new State will do it; and to enmust have been the most powerful inducement or motive force such a proposition would be to strike them from the (and truly patriotic it was) in the larger States to make confederation and dissolve the Union. this great sacrifice of their power and resources; which, Do you believe, sir, that the new States would stand coupled with the idea of doing justice to their creditors, and look on, and see you carrying away the fruits of their and relieving the confederation from its distressing em- hard labor, without a struggle to prevent it, It would barrassments, form the consideration upon which these take away every motive in them to remain a part in the lands were ceded to the General Government; and I hold confederacy, every ground of attachment to the Union, it to be the duty of Congress to sacredly regard this con- and cause them to look to their own resources for protecsideration in all its legislative acts, and to promote the tion. I have said that your appropriations had been the generous and benevolent views of the States in making inducements to thousands to emigrate to those new States. those enormous though necessary sacrifices. Let us see They have broken up, and left their homes, to seek a then whether the amendment to the resolution which home in the wilderness, allured by your deceitful gifts, forms the proposition before the House is calculated in its and, after arriving there, they find themselves called upon consequences to promote that great and magnanimous ob- to pay back the pretended boon. What will they say to ject. So far from doing so, I view it as the most danger-you? Would they admire your justice, or would they deous proposition that ever was agitated in this House, or spise your avarice and fraud? Sir, I have inquired at brought before this nation. What is it, sir? It is to divide what point of time will you refer this calculation of value the public lands among the different States, and to require and division of the spoil. Will you commence at the prethe new States to answer, and pay for all the appropria- sent period? Will you go back to the time when those tions made by the Government toward their improve lands were ceded to the States? or will you refer it to some ment, while you have reaped the benefits of those im- point of time in advance? If you refer it to the time provements to a much greater degree than they. You when the cessions were made, little Delaware would rehave furnished the capital, we have done the labor, and we ceive as much as any of you in the general distribution, are now to be called upon to pay back all that we have for she had as many representatives in Congress then as received, after doing the labor for you. How are you New York; and would she not contend with you that that going to make this calculation of value? what is to be the was the correct principle? She had then, and has yet, standard? where are you to begin? at what point of time? all the burdens of sovereignty to support, without the shall it be calculated for the future? will you make it as means of the other States; and the lands being a gift to you of now, or shall it be nunc pro tune? We are very gravely at a time when she had as much right in the confederation told by the gentleman from South Carolina, that to talk as any of you, it would seem an argument in her favor to about the benefits the United States receive from these ap-fix the division, or allotment, at that point of time. The propriations for improvements, is the most fallacious and object of the trust having now expired, and the trustees preposterous idea he ever heard suggested. Let us see about to take the estate into their own hands, and approif it be so silly and fallacious as that gentleman supposes. priate it to their own use, it seems to me it would be What is the effect of those appropriations and improve- equally if not more just to distribute it according to the ment of the country? Do they enhance the value of your situation and relation in which the parties stood at the time lands, or do they not? Do they not induce popula- of its creation. I say, by this sort of distribution, Dela. tion to flow in by hundreds of thousands? Are they not ware would get a share. Suppose you refer the calculathe means of selling thousands and millions of acres of tion and distribution to the present time, how would it your land, which would otherwise lay waste and wild? stand? What would Delaware get? However, sir, I will Does not this add to the resources of our country, be- pass by this part of the subject for the present, and take sides augmenting the value of the lands? To reduce to prac-another view of it. Sir, I shall never consent, nor will tical results the argument of the gentleman, I will make my State, or the new States generally, consent to stop such a calculation as I suppose he would ask the commit- here with the division, calculation, or distribution. We tee to make, and see whether he be right or wrong. must go the whole, or perchance we shall not be able to

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Congress Mileage and Compensation.

[DEC. 30, 1829.

pay you for the liberal donations you have made us; and this bill, with a view to that object I would earnestly recom where will be the justice of distributing a part of the public domain without the whole?

Here Mr. TEST was reminded by the SPEAKER that the hour for the discussion of resolutions had passed by, and that he must desist.

CONGRESS MILEAGE AND COMPENSATION.

mend to him the saving of time. Time, sir, itself is money, and we ought to economize it. And, although it may be due to that gentleman that he should be allowed to advo cate this darling of his bosom with zeal, I might yet ac knowledge, without intending any personal disrespect, that he has occupied an undue proportion of the time of the House in doing so. If he had allowed the bill to pass

The House then resumed the consideration of the bill without so much debate, after going through the Comfor regulating the compensation for mileage and attend-mittee of the Whole, there would have been no difficulty ance of members; and in it. I invite the attention of that honorable gentleman, The question being upon concurrence in the amendment when he next looks into the subject of retrenchment, to reported by the Committee of the Whole, the object of which is to strike out that part of the bill which places the calculation of distances travelled under the direction of the Postmaster General,

the devising of ways and means by which we can get along with business in this House a little better: that we may not be obliged to hear any gentleman, on a subject of this sort, more than one hour at a time, nor have him repeat the same speech more than three times within that hour: nor to hear him take a wide range concerning himself and the difficulties he has encountered in getting here. I speak of this in general terms, as an evil that needs the correcting hand of the retrenching committee, or some other committee. Upon principles of justice and equality [Mr. L. said] he thought that this bill ought to pass in some shape or Mr. TAYLOR, of New York, adverting to the second other, and he could not but regret its delay, and the obsta section of the bill, (requiring from each member, at the cles which its friends had, no doubt unintentionally, thrown close of each session, a certificate of the number of days in the way of its progress. He admonished his colleague he may have been absent from the seat of Government,) not to be too particular as to terms, and, if he obtained a expressed the opinion that (this principle being intro- bill sufficient for a correction of the evil, to be satisfied. duced into the bill) it ought to be still further amended, This might have been done [he said] without any great so as to make it effective to secure the attendance of parade, by the introduction of a resolution declaratory of members at the sittings of the House. This would not be the opinion of this House as to the intention and construc accomplished by requiring an account of days of absence tion of the law of 1818. The committee, however, having from the seat of Government, because, in legal phraseo- preferred a different mode of accomplishing the same oblogy, the seat of Government includes the whole ten miles ject, he was disposed to acquiesce in it. square of the District of Columbia. To make the provision of the bill more definite, therefore, Mr. T. moved to amend the bill so as to require from each member a statement of the number of days that he should have been absent from the sittings of the House.

It was taken, and decided in the affirmative without a division.

On motion of Mr. WICKLIFFE, the bill was further amended, so as to require the proper officer of the House to obtain from each member the place of his residence, and then, with the aid of the presiding officer of each House, to ascertain and fix the distance, &c.

This child of the bosom of his colleague had been long in coming into the world. The nation has looked for it with intense anxiety. It had been slow in its concep tion, and tardy in its delivery. It was old; though it had been said to be small, yet it was comely. It was a production which [Mr. L. said] he himself admired very much, since it had seen the light; although, from the great Mr. TAYLOR then moved further to amend the bill, so difficulty in bringing it to life, some had apprehended that as that the computation of distance of the residence of the Cæsarian operation would have become necessary be members should be by the shortest road, instead of the fore it saw the day. It has come, however, [said Mr. L.] shortest post road--on the ground that the post road was and I rejoice to see it. I rejoice the more, because it has frequently not the nearest or most convenient road for travelling to a given point.

After some observations between Mr. WICKLIFFE and Mr. TAYLOR, this amendment was agreed to.

a striking resemblance to its father-not to the colleague of mine who laid claim to it yesterday, but to him who has the charge of it; though, really, from the affectionate struggle between my two colleagues as to its paternity, I did not know but we should have to resort to the plan of Solomon of old, and settle the question by dividing the offspring between them. But, to speak seriously, he believed that his honorable colleague who reported the bill was the real father of it, and should have all the credit of so hopeful an heir. He hoped to see it carefully nursed, but not too closely, lest perchance it might be smothered by too much kindness. He also desired that it might inherit all the good properties of its father--all his industry, Mr. LETCHER, of Kentucky, said, that with the greatest ability, and usefulness; and, in saying this, he was not pleasure he would have accorded with the request of the speaking ironically, but he hoped that it would not at the gentleman from North Carolina for an adjournment, were same time inherit an unconquerable desire to talk. Mr. it not for what he believed an unnecessary consumption L. hoped [he said] that we should have its twin brother, of time which it would have occasioned. This House and a good many of the same progeny. He liked the [said Mr. L.] has been already four days engaged in vain breed. He wished to see "reform" here in expenditures, debate on a plain and simple proposition. An evil is admit- as well as elsewhere throughout the country. Though it ted by all to exist in the variant computation of the mile- might be thought small game by some, he would be glad age of members, and a bill is before us to make the con- if his colleague would go on and pursue it. So much saved struction of the legal provision on this subject uniform: is so much gained.

After some observations between Mr. WICKLIFFE and Mr. TAYLOR, this motion was negatived, 100 votes to 50. Some further verbal amendments were made to the bill, on the motion of Mr. STORRS, of New York, Mr. TAYLOR, and Mr. HAYNES.

Mr. CARSON moved to strike out the second section of the bill; upon which motion the mover, and Mr. WILDE and Mr. WICKLIFFE, made some remarks, the first and last of these gentlemen at considerable length. When Mr. SPEIGHT, of North Carolina, moved an adjournment. This motion was negatived.

and, somehow or other, great difficulties seem to stand in As every body seemed willing that this bill should pass, the way of the passage of this bill. But, when we take [Mr. L. said] he had got the floor to ask why the House into consideration the word "retrenchment," that power- should hesitate longer about it. Why not pass it to-day? ful and magical word, so much the favorite of my colleague, He never had himself a doubt as to the intention of the law and his idea of its beginning "at home" by the passage of of 1818; for he never had the acuteness himself to be

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Congress Mileage and Compensation.

[H. of R.

able to find out that "the usually travelled road" was the distances on some of the post routes. Their distances bed of a river, and, therefore, never thought of making were no doubt generally obtained from deputy postmassuch a charge; but, at the same time, he did not condemn ters and mail carriers, who evidently knew very little of the gentlemen who had calculated their travel in that way, the matter. if they thought it just and according to law. Those parts of the bill which had been stricken out, The committee had, however, reported an abuse or an In his district, he had heard no complaints [Mr. L. said] he did consider as conveying an imputation error, and had demonstrated how it had originated, and about the per diem allowance on the mileage of members. on this House, by referring the computation of the mile- had proposed a remedy. The fact that this matter, thus age of members to the Postmaster General. [he said] he wanted no overseer or supervisor of this shows that this error has been gradual in its growth, and House, or what might be called a Congress-Master Gene- that the people have never been fully apprised of its exFor himself, disclosed, had not been spoken of at such a distance, ral. He could never agree to let any officer out of this tent. House regulate its peculiar and exclusive concerns. Gen- ed bill afforded a proper remedy. Mr. S. could not agree tlemen might, on the stump, or elsewhere, harangue about in opinion with his friend and colleague, [Mr. CARSON] It ought, therefore, to be corrected, and the amendthe want of integrity in this House. sidered its integrity the last stay of the nation; and when ruption or dishonorable motives were to be imputed to Mr. L. said, he con- his bosom friend, he might say, that in this matter corthat reliance was gone, he should think the Government members, and that they should resent such attempts. was gone. Such things may be talked of as electioneering topics, and to be witty upon. But, when we come to was based upon the admitted fact that something had be serious, the truth is known and acknowledged, this been done which ought not to have been done; and that He saw nothing in the bill to awaken such feelings. It House has integrity. Having do doubt on that subject, the present law was so defective that such errors might ought we ever so far to bring ourselves into disrepute by occur even with good intentions. The enactment of this our own vote, as to intimate that any individual at the head law would prevent a recurrence of these things, by estaof a department is likely to have more honesty than we blishing a uniform rule. have? I do not acknowledge that any one man, the Post- peach the character or ruffle the complacency of memmaster General, or any other executive officer, up to the bers. highest, deserves such preference over ourselves: for I be-gress were too honorable to need accountability, and that He saw in this nothing to imlieve that there is as much honesty and patriotism in this they should be exempted from responsibility. Members He reprobated the doctrine that members of ConHouse as in any equal number of people upon earth. I look of Congress were, he doubted not, equally fallible with to them with hope and confidence for safety in the worst of other men; and, in this matter, the question is about that times. Let the times be as bad as they may hereafter-I in which men are most fallible, their self-interest. He was do not now speak of the present time--I look to this for discarding such pretensions, and for putting a stop deHouse to protect the public interest. to say, either directly or indirectly, that there is any head two years ago, when these matters were first broached, I never will consent cisively to these malpractices. Mr. SPEIGHT said, that of a department that can and will do more justice to this this Hall, and every Hall in the country, rung with the acnation than the nation may rightfully expect from the counts of the waste of public money, constructive jourHouse itself. heavy duties to perform, with fewer responsibilities, with nion that the question of retrenchment should be fully met, The Post Office Department has already neys, double outfits, &c. more power and patronage, than any other department of and a thorough investigation ordered into all the departthe Government; and all the ability and all the honesty of ments of the Government. He was then, as now, of opiits head is required for its own faithful management. would not therefore agree to place this House under the mence, like charity, at home, and here in this Hall. This control of him, or any other officer whom it might be pro-bill, in part, met his view; and when this should be settled, He quivocally, that this reform and investigation should comBut his opinion was, uneposed to make its comptroller general. Mr. L. conclud- he hoped the committee would prosecute the inquiry into ed by saying he did not wish to consume time unnecessa- certain other matters about the House, the use of stationerily, and expressed a hope that the House would pass the ry, &c. And when the affairs of that House were rebill before its adjournment. Mr. SPEIGHT said, he had not submitted the motion through all the departments, from the Executive down for adjournment with a view of making a set speech on through every office, and examine and reform all the abuse trenched and reformed, he hoped they would proceed the subject of retrenchment and reform. He was fearful which may exist. He had heard, during the last nine that the patience of the House was already exhausted; he months, a great deal of the removal of faithful public offihad not originally intended to take any part in the discus-cers, men who, for many years, had served the public sion; but the innumerable amendments which had been well, and the appointment of others. If these things have made to the bill had induced him to make a brief state-been done without cause, it is proper that such an abuse of ment explanatory of the vote he should give. scarcely expect that the House would attend to him with lic opinion. In these remarks he had no intention of alludthe same good humor with which they had listened to the ing to individuals; the question simply was, the abuse being He could power should be detected, and its authors punished by pubgentleman from Kentucky, [Mr. LETCHER.] That gentle-admitted, should not the remedy be applied? He thought man had been pleased to call this bill a child, which need- it should, and therefore supported the bill as amended. ed nursing and attention to rear to maturity, and professed himself willing to aid in rearing and educating it to useful striking out the second section of the bill, and decided in purposes. Mr. S. thought that the chairman of that com-the negative by a large majority, [153 to 15.] The question was then taken, by yeas and nays, on mittee might say, in reference to the friendship manifested by his colleague, in the words of the Spanish proverb: amend the bill, by adding the following as a new section: "Save me from my friends; from my enemies I can proMr. CHILTON, of Kentucky, then moved further to tect myself." When the bill was first introduced into the dollars per day, and six dollars for each twenty miles House, he was opposed to it, and had so stated unreserv-travel, and computed according to foregoing provisions, SEC. 3. And be it further enacted, That the sum of six edly, mainly on account of that clause in the first section, be allowed to each member of Congress, in lieu of the about which so much debate had been had, directing a present allowance; and that all laws making a greater or reference to the Postmaster General. When this part was different allowance be, and the same is hereby, repealed. stricken out by an amendment, he was disposed to vote for the bill. His objections to that clause were the very some length, and concluded by asking for the yeas and incorrect estimate which the post office books give of the nays upon it. This motion Mr. CHILTON supported by a speech of