feeling should have been somewhat damp- | powers, and compelling all persons coned by the misunderstanding which he was cerned in that election to give evidence beglad to hear now had existed in the public fore the Commission. He must now conmind as to the doubt the Lord Chancellor gratulate the House on the complete success was supposed to have had on that part of of that Act, and the Commission appointed the Report. under it, shown as it was by the blue book SIR GEORGE GREY said, the right then before him containing the evidence of hon. Gentleman who had just addressed the details and the Report the Commisthe House had understood with perfect sioners had presented to Her Majesty correctness the statement made by his founded upon the evidence. The Commishon. and learned Friend the Solicitor sioners stated that they began General. The Report had been presented -"with an investigation into the facts connected only a few days before the meeting of with the last election, in order to ascertain wheParliament it was immediately brought ther the corrupt practices alleged to have preunder the consideration of the Govern- vailed were confined to that election, or whether ment, and a passage was introduced in the they were the result of a system or practice of bribery which there was reason to believe had long Queen's Speech relating to the measure to prevailed in the borough. This course of proceedbe founded on that Report; and his noble ing soon disclosed that the practices referred to Friend at the head of the Government were the result of a system which was the ordithought that the most distinct and authori-nary accompaniment of every contest." [Parliamentary Papers, No. 67.] tative manner in which the intention of the Government could be expressed would be by giving notice of an early day for the introduction of a Bill founded on that Report. He could not sit down, however, without stating that from all he had heard, the legal part of the Commission had derived the greatest possible benefit from the cordial assistance they had received from the association of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Ripon (Sir James Graham), and the hon. Member for Oxfordshire (Mr. Henley); and the Report, which was unanimously agreed to by the Commission, was one for which the public must feel deeply indebted to them. Bill read 2°.

He would not trouble the House by reading long extracts from the Report, and would only allude to some of the more striking facts they had detailed, and which he believed were fully supported by the evidence. They stated that the number of electors, including 107. householders, scot and lot voters, and freemen, was 483, and that the number who usually took bribes was 308; and they stated that the money expended at eight elections since 1831 was 37,0001., of which two-thirds, or upwards of 24,000ʊ., were spent in bribery. Politics, they said, appeared to have no influence in these elections, the agents being ready to transfer their own services and the votes they commanded by the means of bribery, to every candidate who would find the money. At page 20 of the Report, the Commissioners said

"Mr. Bell made his entry into St. Albans on Monday, the 2nd of December, 1850, when the apparent canvass commenced, but Edwards had already begun to see the electors at the committeeroom in Sovereign-alley. The course adopted then, and pursued up to the day of election, was one of systematic, unblushing bribery, which, but for the failure of evidence before the Committee of the House of Commons, we should have thought Sovereign-alley was taken by Edwards. It con

could not have escaped detection. The house in

A door

sisted of three rooms below, and two above; in
one of the rooms below there was always refresh-
ment, and there the voters attended from time to
time in great numbers, in the evening, and waited
until they were introduced to Edwards.
keeper was stationed at the head of the stairs,
whose duty it was to introduce the voters who
inquired for Edwards, singly, to his presence,
in a room where he sat alone. His brother-

keeper; but on this occasion the office was filled

and that Act appointed three Commis-in-law had at former elections acted as doorsioners to conduct an inquiry on the spot, giving them large and extensive

by one of Edwards' sons. Edwards began to see the electors in this room on the 29th or 30th

of November, and on the evening of that day he | As to the individuals themselves who had saw and secured from 40 to 50 voters, to each of given evidence before that Commission, as whom he gave a sum varying to from 51. to Sl., they were indemnified by the Act of Parbut generally 5l. These voters being thus secured were afterward canvassed at their own houses or

MR. KER SEYMER said, that the his powerful borough influence; or did they borough of Harwich being unrepresented in differ at all? He very much wished to that House-[Cries of "No, no!"]-and ask what difference there was between the he having been the chairman of a Commit- man who sold his vote for 51. and the man tee that had sat to inquire into the votes who sold his borough for 2,000l.? He given on the election for that borough, he wished to know that. [Ironical cheers.] must say that of bribery and corruption Yes, it was a question worth their attenthere was only a very slight trace; he could tion in those days, when a new theory was not say more; there was one case in which afloat with respect to the representation of some thought that the election was in- the people, namely, that a nomination bofluenced by corrupt practices, but that was rough was an ease to the Ministry, and a the only case, and that was very doubtful. corrupt borough an evil to the community. He did not say that the electors were im- He hoped that in the Bill the Government maculate; but at all events they were pru- were proposing to bring in to reform the dent, and that prudence ought to serve representation of the people, there would them in good stead. There was no proof be a clause excluding all pretences, all of corruption, and, that being so, he schemes, all admirable contrivances for thought that, having no representative in bringing the influence of the private man that House, the borough ought to have to bear upon the public interests of the some consideration. constituency. In a free representation a poor man sold his vote for 5l., and he was branded in that House with the name of a corrupt voter. Yet, at the same time, a rich man was in the habit of selling what he called influence, and he was allowed to do so with impunity. That was unblameable in a rich man which they punished in the poor. One man might with impunity practise the same amount of corruption, but under a sham and a pretence they came forward to disfranchise St. Albans, because 200 people in that case had done no worse than one rich man did in another borough. Let them no longer practise shams. Let them get rid of nomination boroughs. He should vote for the disfranchisement of this borough and of every corrupt borough; but, at the same time, he should lose no opportunity to get rid of the nomination boroughs.

MR. BAGSHAW said, that no one doubted that up to 1841 the greatest possible corruption did exist at the elections for the borough of Harwich; but he emphatically denied that anything of the sort had taken place since that time. Could anything show it more than the circumstance of Sir John Cam Hobhouse's having been nominated for the borough, and being returned for it without having ever seen the place? But unquestionably, from that time to the present, nothing in the shape of corruption had existed in the borough; and he was delighted to find that the hon. and gallant Member for Westminster would move for a Commission to inquire into the corrupt practices alleged to prevail there, as the bad odour and bad character of the borough would be at once obliterated, and it would come out pure and shining from the ordeal.

SIR HENRY WILLOUGHBY had been nominated to serve on the last Harwich Election Committee; that election was voided not on the proof of any corrupt practice, but because the polling booths had been carried away while an election was polling, before four o'clock.

MR. ROEBUCK said, he was anxious to do away with a sham. There could not be a doubt of the downright corruption of the House. There could not be a shadow of doubt in any man's mind-in his own heart he could not hesitate to decide that such was the case. The question he wished to put to the House was this: Wherein lay the difference between this corruption which they were about to punish in the many, and that which they were in the habit of seeing in a single rich man with VOL. CXIX. [THIRD SERIES.]

LORD DUDLEY STUART said, the hon Member for Harwich (Mr. Bagshaw) had spoken in defence of his constituents, but he did not know whether what he had said would do them a great deal of good, or arrest the wish of the House to get rid both of corrupt and nomination boroughs. He hoped the House would yet adopt such measures as would make the representation a reality, and not a mockery. The hon. Gentleman, however, to prove the purity of his constituents, cited the case of Sir John Cam Hobhouse, who was elected for Harwich without going near it; and he thought that a defence. He (Lord D. Stuart) did not think a man's being unknown to a community was any proof of the purity of his election. He knew an instance of a man who now sat in the House of Lords, who, before Parliament

X

MR. J. BELL said: I rise, Sir, to say that I shall prefer reserving myself for the second reading of the Bill.

was reformed, for two successive Parlia- | He was solicited to go down to that boments represented a borough, and all the rough; he went down by train; he was time he never saw his constituents, and elected without opposition; he asked what never put his foot within the House. He were the expenses of the election, and the hoped the Government would lend their aid, answer he received was, "Mr. Roebuck, by their present measure, to make the that is no business of yours.' [Laugh House what it pretended to be, a repre- ter.] Let not the House sneer at that sentation of the people, and not of landed observation; it could not misunderstand property. it. He asked what were the expenses of the framework from which he had spoken, of calling together the electors, indeed what was called, and properly so, the legitimate expenses of the election; and for these he was told he was not in any way a debtor. That was the last election. Of the two former, the earlier, being the first in which he had ever appeared, cost him not a farthing; and the second was the same; but of Mr. Coppock, his name, or his influence, he had never known anything. That person dared not come where he was a Member, and pretend to be on his side of the question. He said he stood in the country upon his character, and he told the noble Lord that he had put forth flimsy imputations that were based entirely on the fancies of his own mind.

MR. WHITESIDE begged to ask the right hon. Secretary for the Home Department whether the attention of the Government had been directed to that part of the St. Albans evidence which stated that Government places had been the reward of persons who had committed corruption on behalf of Reform candidates ?

SIR GEORGE GREY was ignorant of any such rewards having been given by the Government to which he belonged for such corrupt practices; but the evidence referred to having been given on oath, it was not for him, of course, to question it.

any

LORD CLAUD HAMILTON wished to put this test to the hon. and learned Gentleman (Mr. Roebuck) who had spoken of the corruption of the House, whether, being a member of a certain political club, he ever tried to get rid of a man who bore the character of having corrupted more electors than any man of his age? He asked the hon. Gentleman whether he ever heard of the name of Mr. Coppock, that remarkably active member of the Reform Club; and whether, if he were a member of the Reform Club, he had ever tried to purge that society of his company? No sooner had a vacancy occurred in the representation, than that gentleman was busy, first with the members of the Reform Club, then with the constituency on the scene of action. Had the hon. and learned Gentleman ever tried to put a stop to that gentleman's conduct, which had been notorious for the last twenty years? He thought when the hon. and learned Gentleman spoke of shams, he, like others, was but making a pretence, well knowing a dissolution was near at hand, and sincerely hoping such a debate would not be without its weight at the poll.

MR. ROEBUCK said, he wished the House would allow him to answer the question put to him by the noble Lord. He said he was now Member for Sheffield. He meant simply to answer the question.

LORD CLAUD HAMILTON said, he had asked the hon. and learned Gentleman a question, and his answer had no bearing on it whatever. Was not the hon. and learned Gentlemen a Member of the Reform Club?

MR. ROEBUCK: I am, but I never go

there.

LORD CLAUD HAMILTON: That is an answer.

MR. SPOONER considered the subject then before the House one of grave importance, and which required an answer on the part of the right hon. Baronet the Home Secretary different from that which he had just given to the question put by the hon. and learned Member for Enniskillen (Mr. Whiteside). On turning to the evidence the House would see that Mr. Coppock was asked

"Have you, as a matter of fact-we do not ask any details or any names-exerted yourself to obtain places for those who have served you on those occasions, either under Government

or elsewhere?—I have exerted myself on every occasion to serve those to whom I considered

myself indebted.

"But in that particular way of obtaining a place?-Not more in that way than in any other.

"Have you in that way?—I have taken people into my own office; I have placed them in other railways, and I have got them situations any people's offices; I have got them situations on where.

"And they have obtained them ultimately? I have had clerks in my own office who have had

situations from Government.

"Have you, as a matter of fact-I do not ask any details or any names-exerted yourself to obtain places for those who have served you on those occasions, either under Government or elsewhere?-Certainly, I have exerted myself to serve parties who have served me."

Now, he (Mr. Spooner) thought no person could read these questions and answers without seeing that at some time or the other Government places were obtained on the recommendation of Mr. Coppock. That was a serious charge to be made, and required a serious answer from the right hon. Baronet opposite. He would, therefore, put it to the right hon. Gentleman whether, after that statement, he did not feel himself called upon to examine these cases and see if there was ground for the charge; and if not, vindicate the Government from the obloquy. But if he should decline, then the country would believe that whilst measures were being brought forward to put down bribery and corruption, the Government themselves were the principal promoters of both in the elections of the country. He made no charge, but there was the evidence on oath which he had just read, and therefore it was incumbent in the Government to put themselves right with the country.

"Have you got them situations under Govern- which had been brought forward against ment in any one case?-I certainly have been him. That course, which he had taken the means of recommending people to situations under Government. at the request of his friends, had been misinterpreted, and it had been supposed that he (Mr. Bell) was indifferent upon the subject, or that he was unable to say anything in his own behalf. On the present occasion he was about to utter a few words, when he was particularly requested, as he had been many times before, to sit down. He had so often regretted not having acted upon his own judgment in cases of that sort, that he was determined now to do so. He had admitted the expediency of his abstaining from addressing the House on the subject while a judicial inquiry was pending, and while a number of other persons besides himself, engaged in this unlucky transaction, were capable of being compromised by any observations he might make in defence of himself or the borough; but no such reasons now existed for withholding the explanation which he desired to make to the House. Before he said anything about the borough of St. Albans, he wished, in some degree at all events, to clear himself from the extreme severity of the accusations which had been pressed upon him, and from the imputation that it was with his eyes open he had plunged into this affair, and knowing all the circumstances of the case before him. It was very easy for Gentlemen, taking a retrospective view of a transaction, all the details of which had been mapped out before them, to point out what should have been avoided, and where the difficulties and dangers lay; but he had had no such advantage when he set out in the matter. He had discovered long ago that he had committed one grave error, and that was in going down to St. Albans at all. He committed that error under a belief, which turned out to be entirely fallacious, that there would be no opposition to his return. there not ground for him to suppose that in going down he should not be opposed, seeing that the three parties in the borough had each, through its representatives, requested him to go down? In his ignorance of the borough, and of the politics of the people there, when he found all three parties saying they were willing to support him, surely it was not for him to suppose that any disputes about secondary matters would set any of these parties against him when he had got down amongst them. Having once embarked on the field, having pledged himself to go to

SIR GEORGE GREY: The hon. and learned Gentleman the Member for Enniskillen (Mr. Whiteside), asked me if I was aware that it was stated that places had been given by Government upon the application of certain parties. I told him that if it was so I was ignorant of it; that I had no cognisance of it; but if it was stated upon oath before the Commission, I had no reason to doubt it. I can only say that, judging from the cheers with which the observations of the hon. Member for South Warwickshire (Mr. Spooner) was greeted, no Member now in this House has been guilty of such a course of proceeding.

MR. JACOB BELL said, upon several occasions during this unfortunate transaction he had been placed under a kind of restraint by the urgent desire of some of his friends that he should not take any part in these proceedings. The consequence was, that for about fifteen months he had had a kind of incubus hanging over him, and he had not had the slightest opportunity of making any remark in explanation of the facts

Was