Crown to direct or controul elections, and write 400 letters for that purpose, he could not pafs fuch conduct unnoticed. He had, he faid, taken up the business on great Patriotic principles, and would leave it to the House to determine whether they could repeal their own order, or caufe an infringement of it to be punished.

Without any further debate, the queftion was put on Lord Nugent's motion, which on a division was carried near three

to one.

For it

Against it

87

30

The House then refolved itself into a Committee on the Irifh papers, in which Lord North moved three propofitions which paffed nem. con. The firit was for repealing the act that prohibits the exportation of gold coin from Great Britain to Ireland; the fecond for taking off the prohibition to import foreign hops into Ireland, and the drawback on the exportation of British hops; the third for enabling his Majefty's Irifh fubjects to be come Members of the Turky Company, and to export wooflens in British or Irith fhips to the Levant.

The laft propofition his Lordship thought was neceffary; for the exportation of woollens having been granted to Ireland, the Irish would naturally expect a share in the Turky trade, which at prefent was not poffible, as it was a received opinion, that an Irishman cannot at prefent be admitted a Member of the Turky Company.

Thofe propofitions having paffed, the Chairman left the chair, and the Houfe adjourned.

Tuesday, February 8.

Sir George Savile prefented the Yorkfhire petition, and called the attention of the House to some very ferious obfervations. As Representative, said he, of the refpectable county of York, the largest and most populous of the kingdom, I have often laid before this Houle numberless petitions from my constituents, praying for commercial encouragement, or liberty to enclose waste unprofitable grounds. I have always made it my duty to attend, through every stage, to the bills brought in upon thefe petitions; and indeed I gave more of my time to them than to the management of my own private affairs. I expected to appear to-day before you with many petitions of a fimilar nature; I have waited to the very last day that the House will receive petitions; but my constituents, contrary to their annual custom, have difap

What

pointed me. The partial consideration of enclosures has been loft in the fenfe they entertain of the general diftrefs and grievances of the empire: they have fent me but one petition, and that too of a national import: however, though they have fent but one, it is fuch as, like Aaron's rod had fwallowed up all the rest ever might be the feelings of individuals, the petitioners had taken care to speak of the nation's grievances with modefty; they did not arraign or condemn the measures that had reduced the glory and prosperity of the empire; they did not accufe any fet of men, or recommend any fyftem of politics; it was clear, however, that they with d that the prefent fyftem might not be continued.

Many artifices, faid he, have been employed to difcredit the petition, and those who had figned it. Let me beg leave to fhew to the Houfe a lift of the names of thofe Gentlemen who addressed the Sheriff to call a meeting of the county; it contains 120 as refpectable names as any in the kingdom. Does the House wish to fee the names of those who formed the Committee? There they are: Could greater characters be affembled in any county? Who were those who met at York in confequence of the Sheriff's advertisement ? Between fix and seven hundred perfons of the greatest fortunes in Yorkshire. There was, I will venture to fay, more landed property at the meeting, than now is, or ever was within those walls!

Such were the people who agreed to the petition on which I now lean. Oeconomy in the expenditure of the public money is all they afk. Will any man vote for rejecting fo modeft, fo reasonable a request? I hope not. Will any man vote that this petition be not brought up? No man, I truft, will dare do it. The Minifter will not dare do it, because he knows he ought not to dare it. But there is another thing alfo which he ought not to dare; and that is, to attempt to defeat the object of it. If the Minifter is fo inclined, with the turn of his finger he may destroy it : but let him beware how he directs his influence again't it. Let me advife him to beware how he inftitutes an inquiry into the merits of the petition: it fpeaks for itfelf; and the petitioners will look upon fuch an enquiry as a mockery, as a Parliamentary or Miniterial trick to put an indirect negative upon their petition. When they met to draw it up they were unarmed, they had neither mufkets nor ftaves; but if you mock them, they will

M 2

I'll leave

blanks

banks for the fagacity of the House to fill up.

The petitioners are too refpectable and too numerous to be trifled with: fome of them are poffeffed of the first citates in the county; and the numbers who have figned this petition amount to near 9000 men, all landholders in a county which includes fuch a confiderable part of the territory of Great Britain.

Thefe, Mr. Speaker, are obfervations which I thought it my duty to premife: and, Sir, with your leave, I move that this petition be now brought up.

The Speaker put the queftion, which was carried without a diffentient voice.

Sir George then brought it up, caused it to be read, and moved that it should lie on the table for the infpection of the Members. He obferved at the fame time, that, as an honourable Gentleman behind him (Mr. Burke) intended in a day or two to move fome propofitions in the Houfe, on nearly the fame fubject, he fhould wait to fee if his plan would come up to the withes of the petitioners, before he should move any thing specific on the petition which he had juft then the honour to lay before the Houfe. He could not, however, help obferving, that it was not a little furprising that the fame ideas on public economy fhould have fo naturally occurred at the fame time to his honourable friend, and to the freeholders of Yorkshire.

Lord North faid, the honourable Baronet muft fuppofe Gentlemen to be very ignorant of their duty as Members of Parliament, when he imagined that they might of pofe the introduction of a petition that had for its object the public good. But he muft fuppofe them to be equally ignorant of their duty, and fearful to difcharge it, if he imagined that by holding before them perfonal fears, they might be deterred from weighing any matter that was brought before them. An enquiry ought always to precede redrefs of grievances; and he could not but confels that a petition, depreciating enquiry, came in a very queftionable hape.

Sir George Savile interrupted his Lordhip, to affure him that he had greatly mifunderflood Lim. He had not by any means depreciated enquiry; he had only obferved, that an enquiry which should be calculated more for the purpose of delay, and defeat ing the object of the petition, than for inveitigation, would only be an abfurd mockery of the diftrelles of which the petitioners complained.

Lord North would no longer urge his argument, as the honourable Baronet had

explained his words in a different meaning from that which his argument tended to combat and destroy. But he would fill contend, that it was the duty of a Member of Parliament to enquire before he should pronounce; and in the prefent cafe more particularly. The petitioners, for instance, prayed that no new duty should be impofed. Would any Gentleman fuppofe that fuch a prayer could be complied with, confiftently with the refolutions of the House in the prefent Seffion of Parliament ? Had not ten millions been voted in the Committee of Supply this year? Were there not three millions of last year for the payment of which no fund had been as yet provided? Was he not to propose ways and means for the intereft of these thirteen millions, because a part of the nation did not think it expedient to have new taxes impofed? This was an idea repugnant to fenfe, to justice, and to the exigencies of the State.

Mr. Fox was furprised to hear the noble Lord reafon in fuch a manner. The noble Lord by his fide (Lord George Germaine) certainly could not support him in fuch a mode of arguing. That noble Lord had praised the Irish Parliament, and he had very properly and very juftly praifed them, for inlifting on a redrefs of their grievances, before they would make any. provifion for the payment of money which was already voted. Ireland refufed to impofe new taxes, and the gained her points, The noble Lord in the blue ribbon admit. ted the force of HER arguments, but would allow no force to fimilar arguments within their walls. But the honourable Baronet had not infinuated that no provision fhould be made for the interelt of the fums already granted, till the prayer of the petition fhould have been granted. He only infinuated, that fome ftep ought to be taken towards a redrefs of grievances; that economy fhould be obferved in the expenditure of public money. He had fad nothing by way of intimidating: he had not held up perfonal terrors to the Members of that Houfe; it was the Houfe that was threatened with the greatest of all public loffes, the lofs of public confidence. The petitioners of York, and of other counties, had not ufed arms; peace was all they fought-peace was all they wished for; and there were within their reach peaceable, evil, and conftitutional means to command a redress of their grievances; to reduce the influence of the Crown, and prevent the fquandering of the public money.

The noble Lord had dwelt much upon the

the duty of Members of Parliament, and, instead of elucidating the fubject, he had moft unconscionably confounded two duties, and blended them into one. A Member of Parliament appeared in a twofold capacity-judicial and legiflative. In his judicial capacity, he certainly ought to be deaf to the voice of fear; he ought to be inflexible in what he thinks right, and nothing should divert him from proceeding as his judgment directs. Fiat, justitia, ruat coelum. In his legislative capacity, on the contrary, he ought to litten to those who have appointed him their fervant: nay, though they fhould be wrong, he ought fometimes to pay a deference to their prejudices. They now called upon the noble Lord, and he was bound to hear them. His Lordship always affociated the ideas of enquiry and defeat fo firmly, that, for his part, he could not think that he fuggefted an enquiry, but for the purpose of defeating the peti

tion.

It was faid, that corruption profpered under the prefent Administration; the fame had been laid of the Whigs; but now was the time which would difcover which Government cherished corruption molt. The judgment of Solomon was applicable to both parties.

"We are both accused of corruption; we submit to have it cut up by the root; you will not confent to it; who then are the parents of corruption?'

His honoured friend was surprised that the fame ideas on public œconomy should have fo naturally occurred at the fame time to his other honourable friend (Mr. Burke) and to the Freeholders of Yorkshire. For his part, he was not at all furprised at it; for it was natural, when grievances were become general, that Middlefex and York fhould both feel them.

He told the noble Lord, he had now the most favourable opportunity to gain popularity, if he fupported the petition with all his influence; it was in vain for Oppofition to thwart him; the people would adore him, and think they owed him as many bleffings as they now do the reverfe. The debate terminated here; the queftion was put for the petition to lie on the, table, and was carried.

Friday, February 11. A petition was prefented from Mr. Wood from the Comon Council of London, of the fame nature with that of thofe from the counties, which was read and left on the table.

Mr. Plomer brought up a petition from

the county of Hertford; which was read, and ordered to be left on the table to be perufed by the Members.

Lord North declared he had no good opinion of the motives and views that first gave birth to thofe petitions, nor was his opinion altered upon reading the very titles of them, which, he faid, juftified his fufpicions of the factious spirit from which they had originated: The Petition of the Gentlemen, Clergy, and Freeholders of fuch a county. This implies that the Petition is the Petition of the whole county. If the title had been in thefe words, or to this purpose: The Petition of the Gentlemen, &c. whofe names are underneath fubfcribed,' it would have been unexceptionable; but as it ftands, it conveys a very falfe and unjuft idea, as appears from the Proteft just now mentioned by the noble Viscount, not to mention other protests and other arguments of another kind.

·

Thefe pentions, therefore, cannot poffibly be denominated Petitions expreffing the fenfe of the counties, when many perfons of different ranks, and of large landed property, protest against them. In his idea, they were no more than the petitions of private individuals, complaining of grievances, and defiring alterations, which, as the petitions of individuals, demanded the attention and discussion of the House; and no-body, he believed, meant to oppole the inquiry into the facts ftated in them, in a Parliamentary manner.

The Petition was then read, and ordered to lie on the table.

At eighteen minutes after four Mr. Burke role, he faid, in performance of his promife, in obedience to his duty, and in conformity, he trufted, to the withes of all the people of England, to propose a plan of public economy, at a time when it was never more neceffary to the State. He was not unaware of the difficulties that attended his fituation: his plan, if adopted, might take from a bofum friend his chief fupport; his own future profpects in life might be blafted and he was fure that he mult make himself many enemies -But at his time of life, when he began to Aope his down hill course, he was not to be terrified from pursuing a plan that had for its basis the public good. Younger men indeed, who might outlive the prefent King's reign, and turn their eyes to his fucceffor, might be deterred by the profpect of a long gloomy vifto of Court difgrace, with which a future reign might overwhelm them for an attempt to leffen the influence of the Crown. His views did not go beyond the present reign;

he

he therefore was not guided by thofe motives which prudence would naturally fuggeft to younger men. Oeconomy he pronounced to be the means, not only to reftore us to our former state of fplendor, but also to that state of independence on the Crown, without which it was impoffible for us to be free. Our fituation, he admitted, was not indeed as bad as it was laft year; but it ought to be remembered, that we were now only in the middle of a moft dangerous and expenfive war. We had a moft formidable confederacy to contend with; and great as our refources were, we fhould not perhaps find more than we real ly ftand in need of. A plan of ceconomy, in the first inftance, afforded the moft happy prefage of future fucceffes; but to be effectual it must be fyftematic. Such a plan he flattered himself he had, after in finite pains, digefted, and rendered perfectly practicable. It would effect a faving to the nation of near 300,000l. a-year, without taking from the fplendor of the Crown; without reducing his Majefty to the fmalleft inconvenience; and would for ever free Minifters from the difagreeable neceflity of applying to Parliament, for payments of the King's debts.

As he knew that in all our operations, as well civil as military, we must be guided by thofe of the enemy, he had turned his eyes to the continent, and there he found our enemies making fuch arrangements in their finances, as enabled them to profecute the war with infinitely more probability of fuccefs than we can. We had already exhausted ourselves by an extravagant expenditure of money; our fubjects had already fubmitted to enormous taxes; and yet it had been confeffed by the friends of Government, that after all our efforts, if we were now to make a peace, it must be upon inglorious terms. How much worfe muft our fituation be in two years more, when, while we were prodigal of our treasure, our enemies were most religiously peconomical of theirs. Their extraordinaries fince the beginning of the war never exceeded eight millions ferling in one year; they had lately borrowed about 2,500 000l. and yet they had not funded a fhilling. They had not as yet impofed a ingle tax additional to thofe of their peace eftablishment; they had not established any bur hentome fund for the payment of thefe extraordinaries. The intereft was paid with thole fams which were faved to the State by ceconomy. A general reform bad taken place through France; in the King's houthold, nay, in the Queen's Bed

chamber, and in the menus plaifirs the Royal Family. This he proved from an arret of the French publifhed in Paris the 1ft inftant; and which had been registered in the Parliament of Paris the 29th of laft month. By the reduction of expences, the French financier had faved an income equal to the payment of interest for the loan and for the whole of the extraordinaries; the favings amounted to no lefs a fum than 950,000l. a-year. All this had been effected in a manner in which the fmallest trace of arbitrary power was not to be found. The value of the coin had not been raised; its fubftance had not been reduced; the capital of the national debt had not fuffered the leaft lofs of its value; and the leaft delay had not appeared in the payment of the intereft of that debt. On the contrary, all was conducted in a manner that gave a firm foundation to public credit; and rendered the Minifter who planned, and the Sovereign who had adopted the plans, for ever dear to the people whose property was not invaded, though the greatest efforts were made to raise friends for carrying on the war. The King of France, like a good father of his people, had thought it his duty rather to retrench in his own houfhold than take from bis people. This young Prince, though an enemy he must confefs, deferved the refpect, the esteem, the admiration of Europe. What a gloomy profpect for us! An able Minifter and a Patriotic King directed the affairs of our enemies, while ours were managed by a Patriotic King indeed, but by a much lefs able financier.

To follow the example of Monfieur Neckar, it would be necellary to abolish many places, which a great length of time had rendered, in the opinion of fome men, both neceffary and venerable. He did not charge the prefent Administration with the creation of them; but he would advise them not to maintain them merely because they had been antiently created. The times were now different from those in which they had been established ; and a wife Minister would always conform to the circumftances of the times: he would not fay, that because in the days of the first James, of the Tudors, and Plantagenets, fuch and fuch places had exifted, they must neceffarily continue for ever; the moment a general defire of the people was expreffed for their abolition, fuch a defire ought to be complied with. Etablishing thus a reason why Ministers ought not to oppose his plan, he began to open it to the Houfe; obferving at the fame time, that he was well aware how