through the canal, they would pay the same toll, no matter what class of freight they would carry, even though one carried cheaper freight and got less money for it than the other one.

The CHAIRMAN. Then the carrier of the heavier freight on the larger ship would pay less toll?

Capt. MCALLISTER. He would pay less toll in proportion to the value of his freight.

Mr. GOULD. How do you get the measurement of what the vessel displaces?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Now, you have got to depend

Mr. GOULD. On what you first read?

Capt. MCALLISTER. No, sir; that is for calculating the gross and net tonnage. This is taken on a displacement basis. Then you have got to depend on what is known as the displacement curve.

Mr. MARTIN of Colorado. Has such a system as that been tried anywhere?

Capt. MCALLISTER. No, sir; but I have talked with a number of people, and they seemed to agree that it is a very equitable basis on which to levy the tolls.

Mr. SAVAGE. And you call this a block displacement?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes.

Mr. RICHARDSON. Between yours and the "registered tonnage which would you prefer?

Capt. MCALLISTER. I would prefer the actual tonnage to the net tonnage.

Mr. RICHARDSON. This can be controlled better than the net-tonage system because there is a great deal of fraud in the administration of the net-tonnage system?

Capt. MCALLISTER. There is no question about that, and I will give you an instance: A gentleman connected with the Newport News Shipbuilding Co. told me that they docked a certain vessel, and in proportion to her size the net tonnage seemed very small; consequently they determined to measure this and find out what caused the great discrepancy. It seemed that originally she had been built for a troop ship and the official register of the net tonnage had been ascertained, which omitted a whole deck; companionways had been fitted on this deck instead of hatchways. She had been built for carrying troops, so that her registered net tonnage was about 600 tons less than it should have been.

Mr. RICHARDSON. I would like to have you explain the diffference wherein broad deception comes in between the registered tonnage and the actual.

Capt. MCALLISTER. I was just saying that that is one of the instances where it can be done. For instance, they might provide for a crew of 200 men and only carry 100. Then they would have this allowance taken off for those additional 100 men, and could use it for freight space. They could also raise the floors an undue amount. Mr. HAMILTON. Is not the crew ordinarily carried in what is known as the forecastle?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes.

Mr. HAMILTON. And the poop-that is taken from the gross tonnage, is it not?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; there are a number of deductions. I have here the navigation laws, which show the various deductions.

Mr. GOULD. I want to know how you figure this displacementhow you get at it?

Capt. MCALLISTER. I have first told you how you got the displacement proper, and from that you must depend on the sworn certificate or the certified displacement curve, the curve which is made for each vessel. Now, this curve is arranged like that [indicating], with the draft in feet on this side and the number of tons is the other [indicating]. This particular curve is arranged for one of our own cutters. Now, for instance, you can tell the draft of a vessel, as that is marked on the bow and stern in feet. Each of these figures is 6 inches long. They read from the bottom, and are always 6 inches in height, so you can determine the draft of the vessel as she comes through, and I believe the different countries have heavy penalties for putting them on wrong. But, anyhow, they could readily be checked by the canal authorities. And knowing the draft of a vessel-say she drew 10 feet of water when she entered the canal when that line [indicating] intersects the curve, the displacement would be 810 tons. If there were a heavier load and consequent deeper draft, say of 11 feet [indicating], then you would have a displacement of 950 tons.

Mr. HAMILTON. That is the gross tonnage?

Capt. MCALLISTER. No; that is the displacement tonnage.

Mr. GOULD. It does not make any difference whether she has 400 or 800 tons.

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; a displacement curve must be furnished with each ship.

Mr. J. A. MARTIN. There will be a table like this for each ship? Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; because you have got to depend upon somebody else's displacement calculation. You would have to take this curve as it came from the shipyard where the ship was built.

My system will have all the advantages of the displacement system, and you do not have to depend upon the calculations of others. Mr. RICHARDSON. We frequently read about the displacement of war vessels. That means a different thing from this, does it not? Capt. MCALLISTER. No; every war vessel is rated on her displacement. If you take a battleship of 28,000 tons you are getting her actual condition as she leaves port-her bunkers full, tanks full, and everything under normal cruising conditions.

Mr. RICHARDSON. She goes down in the water so far, and then the water that she moves is connected with the displacement?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes, sir. Water that she replaces, you might

say.

The CHAIRMAN. When you say that a ship has 28,000 tons displacement you mean when that ship is in a certain condition? Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes.

Mr. J. A. MARTIN. Let me ask if you can not explain so that a landsman can understand it-the displacement tonnage and displacement block that have been suggested.

Capt. MCALLISTER. I will do the best I can. Take this long table here in the committee room for an illustration of the "block" idea. A ship of which this would be the block measurement would have a water-line length equal to the length of the table. The beam of the ship would correspond to the width of the table, and the mean

draft of the ship would correspond to the height of the table above the floor. The width of the ship will always be the same, while the length and depth will vary according to the amount of cargo carried. By multiplying the three dimensions together we arrive at the cubical capacity, upon which you would levy the toll.

Mr. J. A. MARTIN. Well, the displacement system applied to a battleship means this, say: A ship is loaded to her maximum, ready for action, leaving port with a full complement of coal, supplies, soldiers, everything; now, there will be a variation as to the condition of a vessel when she enters the canal. She might weigh a thousand tons less when she enters the canal than when she left port, and this would affect her block-displacement tonnage.

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; from the time she leaves port she gradually gets less, but I think the equitable way would be to fix that from the time she enters the canal.

Mr. E. W. MARTIN. Now, if you understand this system, you take into account the three terms-length, width, and depth?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes.

M. E. W. MARTIN. Now, of course, in some given ship a greater or less rate will affect these two elements in competition. It will affect the length and depth, but the width remains uniform. So that with a heavier load you go deeper into the water. It will affect her depth, so that in connection with these three elements the greater loading will call for the greater toll.

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Is that exact about the width?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; practically so.

The CHAIRMAN. But the slope does extend up to the water line, does it not?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; the curve of the bottom on some ships comes up to the water line. The width at the deck is slightly less than at the water line on most ships.

The CHAIRMAN. Then is it not true that the load governs the depth and the other two lines depend upon the depth?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; the depth is the feature of it.

The CHAIRMAN. Both the other lines depend upon the depth?
Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; practically so.

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Mr. RICHARDSON. Suppose you are in the Panama Canal, say, feet depth. What would be the difference between that displacement and out in the ocean, where it is 130 feet deep?

Capt. MCALLISTER. There would be none. The speed of a vessel is affected by the depth of water, but it has no effect on the displacement.

Mr. E. W. MARTIN. But in still water it don't make any difference what the depth is.

Mr. DRISCOLL. Now, the point is, you say, you have to multiply the length, breadth, and depth together. Now, how do you get the rest of it? Is that dependent upon the curve?

Capt. MCALLISTER. No; that is independent of the curve in this "block" system.

Mr. DRISCOLL. Now, you get the length in the water, the width in the water, the depth in the water. How do you get the rest?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Levy the toll on so much per cubic foot or per ton of water displaced.

Mr. SABATH. You say you could tell how much was carried?

Capt. MCALLISTER. That would vary with the depth she had in the water.

Mr. E. W. MARTIN. With heavy loads you would go deeper and pay for it?

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes.

Mr. HAMLIN. Under your system, the depth of the water in the canal wouldn't make any difference?

Capt. MCALLISTER. No; it don't make any difference; you pay for what you carry. It doesn't make any difference whether it is ballast or anything else.

Mr. SABATH. You would be obliged to charge for ballast; that vessel would be obliged to carry some.

Capt. MCALLISTER. Well, the steamer would have to carry it with her or throw it overboard before she went in the canal. That would have to be fixed in the law, as to what ballast would be or would not be allowed. It would be pretty tough, I think, to pay toll on only carrying water from one ocean to the other.

The CHAIRMAN. I can readily understand, Captain, that any system of multiplying the length, breadth, and depth under the block system would be simpler; but is it more reliable and accurate and uniform?

Capt. MCALLISTER. It is uniform and equitable. You do not have to take anybody else's figures. You can make the measurement yourself. You haven't got to depend on anybody else's say so at all. The CHAIRMAN. Will it produce uniformly what would be called the best results for our trade?

Capt. MCALLISTER. I think it would.

The CHAIRMAN. Well, how would it compare in competition with other systems and other canals-other measurements? Would it be convertible into another system by a shipowner who was trying to determine which route he would take?

Capt. MCALLISTER. I think it would. He could very readily determine this himself, what toll he would pay going through this canal and the other one; for instance, in going through the Suez Canal he would know what his rate there would be and he could tell you what his probable displacement would be when he reached the Panama Canal.

The CHAIRMAN. Well, which system of measurement, displacement or gross, produces the greatest tonnage?

Capt. MCALLISTER. That would depend upon the rates you fix on the cargoes.

The CHAIRMAN. You were talking about tonnage. I asked which produced the more tonnage to be paid for.

Capt. MCALLISTER. The greater amount of tonnage would be fixed by the "block displacement" system.

Mr. STEVENS. The ton would be a different kind of ton.

Mr. RICHARDSON. In that way you would be charging for tonnage that did not exist.

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes, in a manner; but that would be equitable for all, as the rate naturally would be lower than if fixed on the "net tonnage" system.

Mr. STEVENS. The gentleman is evidently under a misapprehension. A gross ton is 100 cubic feet, while a displacement ton is a different kind or weight of ton of 2,240 pounds?

Mr. RICHARDSON. So a displacement ton may be two gross tons? Capt. MCALLISTER. As Mr. Stevens has said, one is a certain fixed allowance of space for a ton and the displacement ton means actually a ton or 2,240 pounds of water.

Mr. HAMILTON. May I ask if the system in universal use is not that known as the Moorson, invented by a Frenchman about 1837— is that right? A system for tonnage, 100 cubic feet to the ton?

Capt. MCALLISTER. I really do not know the origin of that or what they take 100 cubic feet to represent.

Mr. RICHARDSON. That is in universal use and came into universal use in 1871, when the Suez Canal was first built. It is in common

use now.

Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; that is in common use now.

Mr. HAMILTON. That does not mean the gross ton as we understand it, but means that the cubic contents is accepted arbitrarily as a ton. Capt. MCALLISTER. Yes; you have to take that as a basis of computation.

The CHAIRMAN. I have found, and others have found, that the net tonnage is a very small percentage of the gross or displacement tonnage. In order to meet that it has been suggested that we adopt a net tonnage, but fix a minimum for deduction of space to be allowed each ship. For instance, it is going to be suggested that you count by the net tonnage, but prescribe that no ship shall pay less than half the gross tonnage. Have you ever considered that proposition and how it would work out?

Capt. MCALLISTER. That would suit some ships and be of great disadvantage to others. They would plan their ships to suit the law. The CHAIRMAN. How would it do just to say gross tonnage and be done with it?

Capt. MCALLISTER. That would be better-to say gross tonnage. Net tonnage is very peculiar.

The CHAIRMAN. Would not the effect be just as it is on all ordinary ships? They would make the passenger liners pay 50 per cent of their gross tonnage as the net tonnage, although the net tonnage might not be more than 25 per cent, while on their freight ships you would charge them away above 50 per cent, so that it would operate the reverse of your displacement-block plan. It would be a very heavy payment on the freight ships and an easy payment on the passenger ships.

Capt. MCALLISTER. It would be a lighter payment on the freight ships, in proportion.

Mr. DOREMUS. I would like to ask a question. If a toll of $1 per ton, based on net tonnage, would pay the cost of operating and running the canal, is there any way you could figure the toll which should be levied under your plan the displacement plan-in order to equal a toll on the $1 basis on the net registered tonnage?

Capt. MCALLISTER. That is a question I have anticipated and have prepared some tables to try and fix some way to get some average