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spine. He said, he hoped to convict Malespinc of perjury, for the shop* were opened the next day after the proclamation, and the advertisement for the sales appeared on the icth of April, and all the sales took place in that month, nor were there any after the 21 ft of May.

He then remarked on the sanctity of General Dundas's word, which was alone a sufficient pledge in comparison with the affidavit of such a contemptible wretch as Malespine, who, he doubted not, was one of the five hundred subsequently expelled from the island, and he could not discover the use of this question since the proclamations were not acted upon,.

As to what had been said of no notary public having dared to draw a pen in remonstrance while the commanders remained in the West Indies, he defied Gentlemen on the other side to produce a single instance in which any complaint presented to those commanders had been rejected.—Lastly, he shewed, in reply to the observations of the Right Hon. Gentleman on our conduct towards the emigrants, that as it was, they complained of neglect, and if it had been otherwise, they would have complained that we had incurred the same principle of retaliation. With a brief recapitulation he then concluded an able and eloquent defence, and said that tinder all the circumstances of the cafe, he was prepared to give his negative to the motion. The disavowal of the proclamations could not be contended to be useful, since they had already been virtually reversed: And when by the motion claiming that disavowal, it was intended to wound the feelings, and to injure the fame of commanders who had rendered their country the most eminent services, and had in consequence received the thanks of that House, whatever else might be thought proper to be done, he at least could have no hesitation in giving it his decided negative.

Mr. Manning explained; he declared that the letters he had read had never been made any improper use os; they had come to him in a regular way, and he had taken such good care of them since, that he was much surprised to hear them argued upon as they had been; he never sent them to any newspaper.

Mr. Secretary Dundas said, that in every view of the question before the House, in which he could argue upon it, he must refill the motion; taking it in all its bearings, it appeared to him a very improper motion to be entertained by the House. He felt himself called upon to make some reply on two grounds, namely, to defend his own conduct in resisting the importunities <i'nd applications of the West India merchants to him, in his official capacity, and to keep the debate as much as possible to the question immediately before the House —the consideration of the papers on the table,'upon which the motion was grounded. On the first point he had expressed his sentiments so fully in the letter * which he wrote to the respectable body of merchants and planters who applied to him, that from the most minute investigation, and upon the most mature deliberation since, he was convinced that it was

Copy of a Letter from Mr. Secrelaiy Dundas to Lord Penrhyn. "Mr Lord, Horse Guards, ttb May 1795.

"I have received your Lordship's note, accompanying the memorial of the Well India planters and merchants, praying for a strong military force, both fcy sea and land, for the general protection of the British West India islands, and a separate garrison to be stationed in each ifhnd; also for a public dis. avowal of the proclamations issued by Sir Charles Grey and Sir John Jervis.

"I feel much satisfaction in recollecting, that at no period since the commencement of the war, has there been a deficiency of exertions in furnishing the West India possesfions with such a supply of both naval and military <lefence as the national force of the country would admit of; and if at any time these exertions have not, in all respects, had their complete effects, it has arisen from circumstances in which it is impossible to impute any blame to his Majesty's ministers. These exertions will be unremitted; but you are aware that in sending reinforcements to the West Indies, the season of the year must of necessity be attended to; and permit me to take the liberty °f suggesting to the consideration of the West India planters and merchants, how far such frequent public discussions on their own supposed weakness, is not calculated to increase, rather than diministi their danger.

"I am well aware that the present warfare is, in almotl every respect, different from any that ever existed; and that there is too much reason to apprehend, that the object of the enemy with whom we are engaged is rather a plan of savage devastation, than of conquest beneficial to themselves; but I cannot admit that such a plan originated in any of the transactions of Sir Charles Grey and Sir John Jervis; it being an absolute certainty, that the system is the natural consequence of the principles on which the present government in France is founded, and existed long before either Sir Charles Grey or Sir John Jervis were employed in the West Indies.

"With regard to the proclamations to which you refer, I think it unnecessary for me to add any thing to what is stated in the letter from the Duke of Portland. It fs notorious that these proclamations were abandoned or annulled almost as loon as they were issued; and it mult be mere pretext, if such use is made of them as you seem to apprehend. I object therefore to the proposition of the West India planters and merchants, because they call upon his Majesty's ministers to establish a general rule on a subject which, in the various usage of war, does not admit of a special definition; and, if the matter occurs to you in the light it does to me, I am sure you cannot be disposed to continue a discussion which can have no other tendency than to injure the feelings of meritorious officers, to whose great exertions their country is much indebted, and in particular that part of the British empire in which the West India planters and merchants are so deeply interested.

"I have the honour to be, Sec. The Right Hon. Lord «• HENRY DUNDAS,"

Ptnrhyn, &c. We.

31 2 . not not possible for him to have done his duty, had he given any other answer. Having read a part of his letter, he said it was his intention upon a variety of grounds to oppose the proposition brought forward, by moving another in its stead. The Hon. Gentleman who brought it forward had very fairly first moved for an inquiry. On a motion of that fort, it was fair for every man to argue upon assertion and supposed facts. They had however abandoned that mode, and come forward that day with a proposition for the House to come to a decision grounded upon the paper before them. He meant no disrespect to either the mover or the seconder of the motion; but they certainly had not kept to the question, and those letters which had been read, apparently written from motives of animosity and malice, he considered as perfectly extraneous. Much of what had been said by the Right Hon. Gentleman in his reply (Mr. Grey), he likewise considered to be not directly to the question. But that Gentleman was placed in a situation totally different from the oilier two. If he had gone farther than the precise order of debate admitted, which he did not mean to fsy the Hon. Gentleman had done, he would have been amply and completely justified in bringing forward every topic, and commenting on every circumstance that could tend to bring before the House and the country the fair statement of all the transactions that had taken place. It became him to act as he had done from every consideration of public and private duty, as well as from thole feelings that must arise from zeal and regard for the honour and character os one that ■was most dear to him, being involved; and from the discussion ps a subject, so interesting to the Hon. Gentleman as the House must feel it to be, he was fully warranted in taking it up as he had done, and entering into every part of the question with a sensibility that the House would give him credit for, and acr knowledge him to be perfectly justified in. While he said this of the Hon. Gentleman's situation, he could not allow that liberty to others: They had grounded all their complaints and fears upon the papers before the House, while they could not, nor had they even attempted to prove that any thing in the proclamation issued on the ioth of May by the commanders in the West Indies, or arising from it, gave just foundation for the fears and alarms they had so industriously circulated. If by an extravagant stretch of the imagisation, Gentlemen attributed to "Sir Charles Grey's and Sir John Jervis's conduct the subsequent and savage conduct of the French, the bare statement was sufficient to refute itself. Did what had taken place at St. Vincent's proceed from those proclamations; or, was it not from the insurrection of the Caribs, aided by Ja

cobins, cobins and their principles, that devastation had followed in that island? The fame might be said of Grenada; and no possible cafe could be made out, which would prove that the proclamations in any manner occasioned the misfortunes which those islands had lately suffered. Another thing which might be said with regard to those proclamations was, that, having been notoriously annulled and abandoned before any proceedings had been had upon them, it was impossible that any actual grievance could be complained of, with justice, on that account, no property of any description whatever having been taken from the inhabitants in consequence of the proclamation: It was therefore still in their possession. This was notorious to all mankind. Every human being in the conquered islands knew it, and knew that orders were gone there not to act upon them; and a proof of the most substantial kind was, that the people there were all in quiet peaceable possession of their property. Were there not, besides, the letters of the King's ministers, which had been stated by the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Barham) to that effect? He was quite at a loss to know what was the object of the address moved for, or what the Hon. Gentleman meant that his Majesty's ministers should advise the King to do. Did they wish a proclamation to be disavowed which had been notoriously annulled and abandoned more than twelve months ago, and was never acted upon? or did tliey wish, knowing that to be the case, and that it was so in those islands, even before instructions from this country could have reached them, that the King should disavow the proceedings of his commandeis, merely because they had been, from the circumstances of the time, necessary, and had not since produced even inconvenience, far less grievance or distress? He had said thus much, because if there existed any fears or alarms respecting the effects of those proclamations, it must by this time be obvious to the House and to the country, that they were the most idle and ungrounded that could be stated, and ought not to be countenanced.

The next point upon which he would detain the House, was the general principle, as far as it was connected with the law of nations, upon which his Majesty's ministers and the commanders in the West Indies had acted. On this he would only fay, that he had acted in concert with his colleagues, and never without having what they considered to be the best and soundest legal advice that they could obtain, or the country could afford him. Were it not that the person * was present, {o whom they owed so much on that subject, he would have

* Sir William Scott, bis Majesty's Advocate General.

said said more; but it was better that the House should have it at first hand, and lie trusted that if he had said nothing inconsistent with the opinions of that authority, he might expect the Right Hon. Gentleman to second the motion. The Hon. Gentleman on the other side, had wished to avoid going into any detail of particulars, and would have the House to agree to a general proposition, without having any facts before them upon which it could be established. With regard to the sums stated as prize-money or booty, Gentlemen ought to recollect that the King had not yet deckled how it was to be disposed of; of course nobody concerned in that expedition could be said to have received it: With regard to the easiness of the conquest, he differed widely from those who seemed to underrate the services performed ; and he contended, that the degree of resistance which the British forces met with, fully justified and warranted every proceeding that had taken place. Those who said otherwise, or spoke lightly of the gallantry and hardships of that expedition, must prove that the Gazettes which he had officially received and published were forgeries. As to the time employed in the conquest of those islands, however wrongly Hon. Gentlemen had stated their opinions on that point, it mattered very little in effect, whether they were taken by a long siege, or a rapid storm. Perhaps it might not be quite orderly in him to (late a plain but honest opinion, which he had received in private correspondence with a friend who witnessed all the glorious transactions of the able commanders so often alluded to; but he would state that a friend had written to him in these words, " It was right, Mr. Dundas, to send out none of your old women, as Generals, upon this expedition: If you had, you would have got into a damned scrape—let me tell you that." He would only add, with regard to time, that the old proverb might, in some degree, apply to the rapidity of success which followed the British arms in the West Indies—" What is soon done, is well done." He did not fay that this applied to all circumstances', but he thought it did to the case he hail stated.

Mr. Secretary Dundas having replied to every part of the debate, as brought on by the Hon. Mover and Seconder, declared that he felt it his duty not merely to give his negative to the proposition moved, nor to get rid of it by the Order of the Day: The duty incumbent on him—the gratitude that the country owed to those gallant and meritorious men, who had done such brilliant services as had merited and received the unanimous thanks which that House had already come lo, pointed out the necessity of doing something further. Hi; intention, therefore, was to move two resolutions,

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